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#1
4164SB

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Recently ran across some info regarding the infamous TAMA/Camco drums. If the shell has a vertical outer ply seam and reinforcement rings it's a left over LA Camco shell. If the shell has the same vertical seam but no re-rings it's a Jasper maple ordered for the drums assembled in PA. That way TAMA could get away with putting USA on the badges although everything else on the drums came from Japan. Dig the BOP set below...
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#2
Supefly

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If the shell has a vertical outer ply seam and reinforcement rings it's a left over LA Camco shell.


It make sence

If the shell has the same vertical seam but no re-rings it's a Jasper maple ordered for the drums assembled in PA.


I been reading something like that, on some Tama forums ... but I do not belive on it...
They(tama forum people) are completly confused about all that have to do with Camco - and they been heard taht Camco used Jasper and Keller shells. So , becouse those Tama/Camco is not Keller... they have to be Jasper. :rolleyes:
Thats what impression I got when I been reading Tama/Camco/jasper threads...

But , if you realy know, that it´s like that , that means that those Tama/Camco is realy undervalued?!? I never see live, or ben hearding tama/camo set , so I do acctualy not know how good/bad they are.
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#3
Titletown Tim

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?
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#4
4164SB

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Whether the shells were Jasper or Keller is of no concern to me. I'm more interested in the fact that there might be LA Camco shells floating around disguised as TAMA/Camco. Also, that the later USA versions were actually American maple instead of Japanese birch. Here's a pic of the bearing edge from the non-re-ring shell, looks identical to the early Superstar edges.

Edited by 4164SB, 19 August 2011 - 05:23 PM.

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#5
TommyWells

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Tim: 74 L.A. Camcos would have the undersized shells for the toms. Hard to find.... The Drum Doctor has some.
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#6
DolFan54

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?


LA Camco ran from '73-'78 Keller shells w/ re-rings. I've never heard nor seen an LA Camco shell w/o re-rings. I have seen vertical inner plies on the tom shells though.
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#7
Supefly

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?


LA Camco ran from '73-'78 Keller shells w/ re-rings. I've never heard nor seen an LA Camco shell w/o re-rings. I have seen vertical inner plies on the tom shells though.


woww... I didn´t know they offer vertical ply at that time, on Camco.
You think it as something speciall you could order, or ther was simply som plies that was to little, so they (Keller)may-be simply made a vertical ply in toms of those parts,isead of "usualy" horisontal?
Was all 6 plys vertical, or cross laminated, on those?
And , do anyone know, is it true that vertical ply give more/faster projection than horisontal ply?

Edited by Supefly, 20 August 2011 - 02:49 AM.

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#8
Supefly

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?

Shells from Keller, during LA time, 74 to 78, was made with those undersized shells.

But, do anyone know, how many DW is made with "same" undersized shells?
Dw took over approx 100 shells , i´ve been read everywhere, and continue to build the drums with those. So those "first 100 DW" should be as same undersized as those 74-78 LA camco, right?
And DW continue to built their drums on same way , as LA Camco, with Keller shells up to 1986, then they start with their own shells , but was all sets up to 1986 DW continue to order from Keller, undersized as well as those first?
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#9
Supefly

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?

Shells from Keller, during LA time, 74 to 78, was made with those undersized shells.

But, do anyone know, how many DW is made with "same" undersized shells?
Dw took over approx 100 shells , i´ve been read everywhere, and continue to build the drums with those. So those "first 100 DW" should be as same undersized as those 74-78 LA camco, right?
And DW continue to built their drums on same way , as LA Camco, with Keller shells up to 1986, then they start with their own shells , but was all sets up to 1986 DW continue to order from Keller, undersized as well as those first?


Oh, soory , didnt DW use Keller until 1997?
And one more thing, I hae been read that :
By the way the keller shells the old DW's were made of were the thicker 1 mm per ply shells.
Maybe that made ( IF they were???) even old DW shells undersized?

Edited by Supefly, 20 August 2011 - 03:21 AM.

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#10
4164SB

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"Our shell is a very close duplicate of the original Camco drum shell. It's an exact duplicate in terms of shell construction, counterhoop thickness and dimensions. The outside diameter is slightly larger than what the original Camco shells were because we don't account for using a plastic or synthetic to cover the shell."

Dom Lombardi
Modern Drummer
1982

The heads on this 1982 kit have plenty of room!

Edited by 4164SB, 20 August 2011 - 10:48 AM.

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#11
Titletown Tim

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?

LA Camco ran from '73-'78 Keller shells w/ re-rings. I've never heard nor seen an LA Camco shell w/o re-rings. I have seen vertical inner plies on the tom shells though.

I have a line on some LA Camcos that I'm told are from 1974. There are no date stamps or serial numbers so seller is going on info from previous owner. These shells do NOT have re-rings. Perhaps pervious owner is mistaken on the correct date of these drums.
Is there any other way to get an accurate date on Camcos?
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#12
4164SB

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Vertical ply seam?
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#13
DolFan54

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Can you get a pic of the bearing edge with the head off. I'm curious as I've never seen nor heard of a Camco shell w/o rings. Those grommets look suspicious by the WAY. I'd like to see the inside where the grommet is too.
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#14
Supefly

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Can you get a pic of the bearing edge with the head off. I'm curious as I've never seen nor heard of a Camco shell w/o rings. Those grommets look suspicious by the WAY. I'd like to see the inside where the grommet is too.


You are the man about Camco... but, why did they look strange? My badge gommets look the same
, as far as I can see?!?!
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#15
Titletown Tim

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I emailed seller for bearing edge and inner shell pics. Stay tuned...
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#16
Supefly

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My curiosity is up now with Camco. What is the time line on the Camco/Tama change over on shells? Would a LA Camco set from 1974 have the desirable undersized shells even if it did not have re-rings?

LA Camco ran from '73-'78 Keller shells w/ re-rings. I've never heard nor seen an LA Camco shell w/o re-rings. I have seen vertical inner plies on the tom shells though.

I have a line on some LA Camcos that I'm told are from 1974. There are no date stamps or serial numbers so seller is going on info from previous owner. These shells do NOT have re-rings. Perhaps pervious owner is mistaken on the correct date of these drums.
Is there any other way to get an accurate date on Camcos?


I never heard or see ( ehumm... I acctualy didnt EVER see Camco live here in Sweden only on pict. :-) , except mine ) , ... anyway... serial number or date on camcos.
And there is unforantly even verly few brochure ( you say so? ) from that time, so there is not lot information to get. But, sizes can say some- smaller sizes ( often ) in the beginning, and cross the time, bigger. And of course, ply - 2, 4 or 6. Aad, what badge says. ( your was LA, you said) So there will be a gap when they could have been made.
Was there att all clear maple on Oaklawn set at all? I do not remeber there was something else than wraped drums from that period?
So to find out when between 74 and 78 they are made, I guess is impossible.

Edited by Supefly, 23 August 2011 - 03:53 PM.

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#17
4164SB

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If those LA Camcos have no re-rings and are legit, it'll be a new bit info regarding Camco history!
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#18
DolFan54

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You are the man about Camco... but, why do they look strange? My badge grommets look the same
, as far as I can see?!?!


Look at this image. The grommet should not look so clean and is a tad bit smaller as far as the lip goes than compared to the natural Camco pics above. There should also be a number on the interior re-ring done in black or red pen.

Posted Image

Posted Image
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#19
Jolo

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I've owned and seen many LA Camco shells and I've never seen or heard of an LA shell without a re-ring.
Those shells are so thin that they probably wouldn't work very well without one. I once had to play an
LA 12" tom on an LA 22" bass without the front head because we had to start a gig early. That tom
bounced around all night because the bass shell was so thin. Off hand I don't know of any other top
drum maker's shell that would have done that.
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#20
Titletown Tim

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Seller has not replied to my emails, but here are 2 more pictures.
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