11 inch Paiste 2002 splash

gezz

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Refreshing thread..great hearing all your stories and love for Paiste..
One day.. I just fell out of love with Paistes... Maybe my ears changed but I found the A custom line and A brilliants I was coming across just were what I was loving playing..
I still own a few paiste.. But they sit in a cymbal bag..
Gerry
 

Toast Tee

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I guess it's all subjective. I have, and own several Zildjians myself. I really liked the A Custom Projection line (which I never let go of). I also have several A's, but got rid of my K's.
Dark cymbals seem to be the thing these days, but they don't appeal to my ears as much. I still will use a 10 inch A Custom splash at times with the Paistes. I like a change in tone with accent type cymbals.
Which Zildjians do you use? I do like the 21 Sweet Ride mic'd, and mixed. I actually thought about picking one up, but when I played em, they just weren't as pleasing to my ears. They do sound great recorded.
 

Sonorholic

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Back in the late 70's when Rogers were distributing Paiste and the 2002's were a new thing, the only small cymbals they offered were the 8" Bell and 11" Splash. I had one of the splashes for years and loved it. Don't know what happened to it. Such is the drummers life..;)
 

zenstat

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Back in the late 70's when Rogers were distributing Paiste and the 2002's were a new thing, the only small cymbals they offered were the 8" Bell and 11" Splash. I had one of the splashes for years and loved it. Don't know what happened to it. Such is the drummers life..;)
From the 1977 price list we've got the 2002 11" splash confirmed.

Rogers-1977-prices.jpg

No 8" Bell on the 1977 price list, but the bell does appear in this 1978 flyer

rogers-paiste-flyer-1978.jpg

with the relevant quarter in more legible size (I hope)

Rogers-Paiste-Offerings-1978..png


Thanks to my fellow Paiste researchers for finding these gems. For me (and germane to general Paiste discussion) what's revealing is that if you look at the 1977 price list Rogers put all those cymbals under the 2oo2 heading but there are 602s hidden in there! Rogers didn't emphasize series or alloy. The 22" Dark Ride is our old friend the 602 Dark Ride which are now called "Transitional Dark Rides" because they have the Paiste logo but no Formula 602 on them. They are all from 1976 and 1977 (based on serial numbers) although there are some 602 Dark Rides from 1976 and 1977 as well. You can spot the price difference if you compare the Dark Ride price ($288) with the 22" ride from the other column: $150. I'm not sure whether there are some other 602s hidden in there as I haven't had time to go through all the evidence. But I wonder about the flat rides and the china type just on the pricing differential.

The price list from 1977 is also a reminder that the Medium was a model in its own right. There were Crashes, Mediums, and Rides. I mention it in this thread although it was discussed in a couple of other places recently. In the flyer it mentions the ambiguity about the Medium calling it a crash for heavy players as well as a good ride cymbal. Versatile. And look: there is a Heavy Ride as well.
 

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EvEnStEvEn

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I owned the Bell and the 11" splash during those years. late 70's - early 80's, along with a full set of 2oo2 mediums, crashes, china-types, SE hats and heavy ride.
 

Toast Tee

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If you guys had an op to by some of these, would they be of value?
 

zenstat

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I owned the Bell and the 11" splash during those years. late 70's - early 80's, along with a full set of 2oo2 mediums, crashes, china-types, SE hats and heavy ride.
What do you think about the possibility that the 1976-1977 Rogers offerings of the china type and flat rides might have been 602s in that one price list? Since the demise of the Paiste Only Wiki I don't have an easy place to check the production years for a 2oo2 china type or flat rides. And since I'm not really a 2oo2 guy I'm out of my depth when it comes to specific models and which years saw them produced.
 

EvEnStEvEn

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What do you think about the possibility that the 1976-1977 Rogers offerings of the china type and flat rides might have been 602s in that one price list?
I think it's possible, Steve. But only speculative at best, as 602 pricing from that era is not my area of expertise.
 

toddlittle827

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Those are 2002s. The 2002 China types came out in 1971 at initial release of the line. The 2002 Flat Ride came out in 1975 with the bell and 11" splash and the 20" Heavy Ride.
Rogers initial stock of 2002s was a bit limited and for a while the 602s were special order only with the exception of the Dark Ride.
 

zenstat

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Those are 2002s. The 2002 China types came out in 1971 at initial release of the line. The 2002 Flat Ride came out in 1975 with the bell and 11" splash and the 20" Heavy Ride.
Rogers initial stock of 2002s was a bit limited and for a while the 602s were special order only with the exception of the Dark Ride.
With a bit more research under my belt it still looks like the pricing of the Flat Rides and China Types and that 11" Splash are also 602s. Possibly the Sound Edge hats as well. 602s were priced at a premium to 2002s. I realize that these models were available in the 2002 line, but the price spread between 602s and 2002s doesn't seem quite right in the Rogers catalog. Were they charging 602 prices for these models? Or did they have 602s and not 2002s in stock? I've currently written things up this way in the wiki


but if I'm incorrect I'll happily change that.
 

kb

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I distinctly remember Paiste touting the 11" splash size as "more musical."

Back then I had a whole set of black label 2002's: 20 ride, 18 medium, 16 crash, 20 china type, 14 SE hats. Such a big change from the motley Zildjians I had before. Really enjoyed them for a while....

Then I bought my first Canadian K and within a few years all the Paistes were gone....btw, in those days we hardly ever saw 602's for sale here in SF Bay Area, just the 2002s and later the Sound Creation (?) series.
 

dje31

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I seem to recall the early '80s era 2002 and F602 splashes were always 8" and 11". There were no 6", 10", or 12," unless special order (if they even did those back then).

But then, splashes weren't all that common, besides jazzers and Stewart Copeland...and I think read that many of SC's original splashes came off kids' toy drum kits.

In retrospect, I'd guess that, even today, 8" and 11" probably make for a good complementary combo, without overlapping each other.
 

toddlittle827

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Steve, just had a look at my Rogers/Paiste materials

those are definitely 2002s and Rogers was simply charging an extra premium on the specialty 2002 models

I have a 1980 Rogers price list (which even the guys on the Rogers FB group don't seem to have ever seen)

The same overcharge on the 2002 Flats, Sound Edge and Splash etc. is seen on this later price sheet (attached - sorry crappy pic of it but it's all I got) and this is when Rogers also was offering the full line of 602s, so there is no doubting what is what on this sheet. 20" 2002 Flat Ride way more expensive than a 20" 2002 Ride etc. etc.
 

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kallen49

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In 1975 - 76 I was a teenager working in a music store in Burlington Ontario (45 km west of Toronto).
We sold A Zildjians, Zyn and Paiste 2002 cymbals and I recall Paiste were certainly more expensive than Zildjians. (Sabian didn’t exist yet). Can’t recall prices but I remember selling new 2002s, in particular, 14” sound edge hats, crashes, 20” China’s and an 18” flat ride. I think we stocked (and sold) more Zildjians because of the cost difference.
Don’t recall many formula 602’s but from that store I do have a formula 602 “seven sound set” 8 inch effect cymbal which still makes a spectacular amount of sound for a small piece of metal.
I do recall seeing a bin of 2002 Paiste 18” flat rides at Long & McQuade in Toronto in about 1978 and they were being blown out for $50 each! (wish I had bought a couple).
 

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