1963 Original Ludwig Super Classic, Ringo-Beatle Spec Snare, Complete. Best Ringo set ever!

[Mcjnic]

If this helps ...
This is from a very early 1960s Ludwig bass drum wrapped in Gold Sparkle.
It was part of a restore project I did back in 2010.
I have run through quite a few (read many more than a few) vintage drums with the measurements and/or initials inside.
I don't recall ever having one with a previous owner's name or initials inside.
All of mine appear to have been from the factory.
Granted, I wasn't there when the initials were applied ...
but it doesn't require extreme depths to reason through the amount and similarity of scribbles inside the drums.
They were ALL very quickly scribbled and usually with either grease pencil or such.
None were done neatly and legible, which one would expect if one was personally scribing a drum for identity purposes.
It becomes a logical conclusion that these were not put there by the end user ... but by an employee at the factory.

 

[K.O.]

If this helps ...
This is from a very early 1960s Ludwig bass drum wrapped in Gold Sparkle.
It was part of a restore project I did back in 2010.
I have run through quite a few (read many more than a few) vintage drums with the measurements and/or initials inside.
I don't recall ever having one with a previous owner's name or initials inside.
All of mine appear to have been from the factory.
Granted, I wasn't there when the initials were applied ...
but it doesn't require extreme depths to reason through the amount and similarity of scribbles inside the drums.
They were ALL very quickly scribbled and usually with either grease pencil or such.
None were done neatly and legible, which one would expect if one was personally scribing a drum for identity purposes.
It becomes a logical conclusion that these were not put there by the end user ... but by an employee at the factory.



View attachment 561035

Yeah, the nearly universal greasepen letters/sqiggles were obviously some part of the production process. Not to be confused with owners who sometimes legibly added some identifying information somewhere on the drum.

 

[Ludwigboy]

If this helps ...
This is from a very early 1960s Ludwig bass drum wrapped in Gold Sparkle.
It was part of a restore project I did back in 2010.
I have run through quite a few (read many more than a few) vintage drums with the measurements and/or initials inside.
I don't recall ever having one with a previous owner's name or initials inside.
All of mine appear to have been from the factory.
Granted, I wasn't there when the initials were applied ...
but it doesn't require extreme depths to reason through the amount and similarity of scribbles inside the drums.
They were ALL very quickly scribbled and usually with either grease pencil or such.
None were done neatly and legible, which one would expect if one was personally scribing a drum for identity purposes.
It becomes a logical conclusion that these were not put there by the end user ... but by an employee at the factory.



View attachment 561035

I agree completely. My best guess was an Ludwig employee initializing that his/her work was completed or Ludwig inspector initialing to acknowledge that the drum/wrap/workmanship was inspected.

 

[Commodore]

I agree completely. My best guess was an Ludwig employee initializing that his/her work was completed or Ludwig inspector initialing to acknowledge that the drum/wrap/workmanship was inspected.

These "AR" marks were both found on the "relative handful" of 5.5 OBP shells made over several years.
I'm gonna say this is on 25% of production.

I cannot "prove" anything. My only "proof" is that I was willing to spend big money...

We all love drums, here!

 

[p83]

i have a bunch of ludwig drums with an inspector's mark.

 

[jptrickster]

a. R. very popular in 60’s snare drums , have seen it many times on various wraps as well as Acros and Supras.

 

[JimmyM]

AR is also used by MI companies. I have an AR guy I occasionally hassle for new gear at Ampeg. Artist relations.

 

[ellaguru]

i have a bunch of ludwig drums with an inspector's mark.

Thats what i think is scribbled inside my Supra...looks like a backwards 5 or some sort of G.

 

[yetanotherdrummer]

a. R. very popular in 60’s snare drums , have seen it many times on various wraps as well as Acros and Supras.

So then, the mystery is..........who is A.R.?

 

[jptrickster]

So then, the mystery is..........who is A.R.?

I dunno Bill Ludwig might. My guess is a pretty lady who worked on final assembly

 

[drumtimejohn]

Andy Renalds.

 

[drumtimejohn]

Andy was also signing shells in ‘67.

 

[Houndog]

Remember when we used to scribe our SSN on everything ?

 

[K.O.]

Remember when we used to scribe our SSN on everything ?

I've found quite a few SS numbers inscribed on drums. Often engraved into the hoops.

When I was in college (early 80s) they used your SSN as your ID (that was when I memorized it for the first time) and they'd post grades with the number instead of your name ( to protect your identity). Imagine bulletin boards full of lists of valid and active SSNs? I guess it was a simpler time.

 

[jptrickster]

Remember when we used to scribe our SSN on everything ?

That’s why I collect vintage drums

 

[Commodore]

My bet is on "a" or "AR" standing for Artist's Relations.
These drums would have then gotten a higher degree of finish.

If it were an individual builder's initials ...there would be loads of different ones.

We do know Ludwig was also trying to promote OBP during the time period.
That they ultimately got Ringo's attention, ...would be a crowning achievement!

 

[drumtimejohn]

Lagina, Marty

 

[K.O.]

My bet is on "a" or "AR" standing for Artist's Relations.
These drums would have then gotten a higher degree of finish.

If it were an individual builder's initials ...there would be loads of different ones.

We do know Ludwig was also trying to promote OBP during the time period.
That they ultimately got Ringo's attention, ...would be a crowning achievement!

Seriously ???

As someone who is often guilty of wild conjecture that theory pushes the limit even for me.

First of all there were no individual builders. It was an assembly line process with each person doing a single task on a dirty, noisy, factory floor. At some point someone overseeing the wage slaves going through their 8 hour shift would judge the process so far to have been done good enough and scribble their mark in the drum. One letter, two letters, whatever they wanted to do to indicate that they had glanced at the drum. It wasn't guys in white lab coats carefully assembling musical instruments, it was people of all walks of life from the local neighborhood who happened to get a job there and put in their shift.

 

[drumtimejohn]

Andy was also signing shells in ‘67.
View attachment 561194

I believe the story goes since Mr. Renald’s was the only Andy in shop he was allowed to drop the “R” to save time during the 60’s boom. This also explains why we see more single letter initials as time went on.

 

[drumtimejohn]

Further proof of the Renald’s clause. Early mahogany, 2 initials. Later maple, 1 initial.