20” Constantinople medium thin low vs high vs Renaissance!

Jazzhead

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Hi All,
I would like to know the difference in sound and other elements of these 3 cymbals (20” Constantinople medium thin low vs high vs Renaissance) and which one would be the most versatile?
I assume the low/high refers to the pitch of the sound but I have heard all three cymbals in videos and all 3 really have blown me away. I heard a renaissance in a video recorded by a phone as well and it still sounded brilliant.
 

Freewill3

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Typical with Zildjian, all 3 of these can vary depending on weight. I scored a 20" Renaissance about 2 years ago @ 1758 grams, the lightest I've seen anywhere. I did A/B with the medium thin high and low and just found the Renaissance to have the perfect amount of everything, wash, stick, although the bell is integrated fairly well and wasn't very pronounced compared to the others. I'd say trust your ears if you have to depend just on sound files or at least make sure you can return/exchange from wherever you purchase from.
 

Jazzhead

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Typical with Zildjian, all 3 of these can vary depending on weight. I scored a 20" Renaissance about 2 years ago @ 1758 grams, the lightest I've seen anywhere. I did A/B with the medium thin high and low and just found the Renaissance to have the perfect amount of everything, wash, stick, although the bell is integrated fairly well and wasn't very pronounced compared to the others. I'd say trust your ears if you have to depend just on sound files or at least make sure you can return/exchange from wherever you purchase from.
Thanks. I am kind of leaning towards the renaissance as well, seems to be that perfect balance in the Constantinople line but I see lots of jazz drummers playing the medium thin low.
 
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Josh Vibert

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I don’t know if this’ll help you or not. I had a 22” Ren and hated it. Too bright. Now I have a 22” MTL and a 20” Ren. Now THAT is a winning combo! The 20” Ren is much better to me than the 22”.
 

10 Lug

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I don’t know if this’ll help you or not. I had a 22” Ren and hated it. Too bright. Now I have a 22” MTL and a 20” Ren. Now THAT is a winning combo! The 20” Ren is much better to me than the 22”.
QUOTE)

Exactly what I'm using right now, love it. Took a while to get used to the Ren, these cymbals need to be played not just hit. Beautiful musical sound.
 

Jazzhead

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I don’t know if this’ll help you or not. I had a 22” Ren and hated it. Too bright. Now I have a 22” MTL and a 20” Ren. Now THAT is a winning combo! The 20” Ren is much better to me than the 22”.
Yup, I like the 20” Ren more, that’s why in my title I have 20” but with the 22” MTL seems like a killer combo but are these two cymbals versatile? I know they are both great for jazz but what about if I want to play some rock? Aren’t they a bit quiet cymbals without much ping?
 

Josh Vibert

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Yup, I like the 20” Ren more, that’s why in my title I have 20” but with the 22” MTL seems like a killer combo but are these two cymbals versatile? I know they are both great for jazz but what about if I want to play some rock? Aren’t they a bit quiet cymbals without much ping?
I guess it depends on what kind of rock, room, mics or no, etc. I traded the 20 Ren our for a 20 K Cluster crash out for this tune since it's more crash heavy, but I think the 22 MTL is plenty defined here.

 

Jazzhead

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I guess it depends on what kind of rock, room, mics or no, etc. I traded the 20 Ren our for a 20 K Cluster crash out for this tune since it's more crash heavy, but I think the 22 MTL is plenty defined here.

Well I want a 20” that can do great in jazz and blues, but also work for soft rock and classic rock songs, nothing heavy or hard hitting style.
I can go with a 2013+ Zildjian A medium for that all-around capability but it won’t really be fantastic for jazz and blues I assume.
 

Josh Vibert

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Well I want a 20” that can do great in jazz and blues, but also work for soft rock and classic rock songs, nothing heavy or hard hitting style.
I can go with a 2013+ Zildjian A medium for that all-around capability but it won’t really be fantastic for jazz and blues I assume.
That's a fair assumption, but will depend on your stick and touch. 20" K Custom Dark would work ok for what your talking about. 20 Ren would be better (more stick/less wash).
 

Jazzhead

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That's a fair assumption, but will depend on your stick and touch. 20" K Custom Dark would work ok for what your talking about. 20 Ren would be better (more stick/less wash).
Yea I think I will go with 20” Ren for my main ride. Nice drum cover by the way. I like how that 22” sounds, great stick definition.
 

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20 MTH is a good one but I've had bad and good ones. Good LSR, not a main ride. The 20 MTL didn't work for me - too dark but high pitched (still lower than a MTH).

I had a 22" MTL that was fantastic - woody stick, dark crash and lovely bell, but then scored a 22" Light that mimiced it so I sold the MTL after numerous A/B's of those cymbals (and I found out my man Brian Blade has a 22 light on his right side!)

As for the Ren - I bought a 20 but it didn't do anything for me. Wasn't like a MTL or MTH. But I am on the lookout for a 22 Ren.....still!
 
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fitzsy

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The 20" Ren is a very soft cymbal. Good LSR for quiet jazz, really good crash. I use a 20" MTL on the far right with a 3 rivet cluster.
 

Jazzhead

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I get mixed messages about the 20” Ren and also the 20” MTL.

what would be the zildjian equivalent of 21” Istanbul Agop Mel Lewis signature ride?
 

Markkuliini

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I get mixed messages about the 20” Ren and also the 20” MTL.

what would be the zildjian equivalent of 21” Istanbul Agop Mel Lewis signature ride?
In my opinion nothing really.
It's a relatively thin cymbal, with low bell. BUT it's not very complex or low or dark for it's thickness. It's kind of between 2 worlds, kind of like thin A but still lower since the bell shape and size.
Maybe K Light in 22" or 20" might come relatively close. They have similar type bell and are quite similar in weight to too.
Avedis rides have too big bells to really come close although they have other similar qualities. And Constantinoples are bit too complex with their deeper hammering to duplicate Mel Lewis-sound.
It's a cool in-between sound that I wish more cymbal makers would try to recreate.
 
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Rick

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From what you described, I think the K Con 20" Medium ride might do all that for you. I have one and use it for all those types of music. It's great! Here's the video of mine (I bought this one from Memphis Drum Shop). If you could find one around the same weight, I think it might do the trick really well...

 

Jazzhead

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From what you described, I think the K Con 20" Medium ride might do all that for you. I have one and use it for all those types of music. It's great! Here's the video of mine (I bought this one from Memphis Drum Shop). If you could find one around the same weight, I think it might do the trick really well...

Doesn’t seem it is crashable, is it?
 

Jazzhead

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Can you tell from the sound/look what ride is on the right side of this drummer?
It looks like a 20” K Con (comparing to the 16” floor), but can’t tell which model, from the behavior of the cymbal to the ride pattern and the crash it seems like a medium, it looks like a heavy cymbal though.
Cymbal action can be seen at around 02:10

 
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