A Cymbal that just SHOULDN'T be this good!

Franklin Nigel Stein

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A bit before the pandemic, one of my internet drum email guys (I'm starting a new term, I-deg) read my complaint that I couldn't find a certain kind of sound that could only be found in a marriage between old A/K Zildjian and early New Beat hi-hat cymbals. He sent me a picture and said that I should look around for one of these early A. Zildjian cymbals to use as a bottom hi-hat, and the rest would take care of itself. This one is a 15in early A. Zildjian c.1935 that weighs in at 1454g. Really and Truly, this cymbal shouldn't be this good, but it turns itself into half of an incredible pair of dark/smooth/sweet/NewBeat-like hi-hats.

I've seen this type of large / deep hammering on some heavy 1930s Zildjians as well as a few trans stamp examples, and in sizes from 12 to 16 inches in diameter. It seems likely that all those large diameter impact marks cancel out the higher frequencies coming down from the top

Do us all a solid and share a bit of your personal cymbal knowledge and good fortune (ah-winkwink).

What have you stumbled onto that would really help someone else's search for "THAT" special sound?
 

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Franklin Nigel Stein

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And this is what I did with it:

I made a sort of . . . Frankenpair. The top is pretty thin at 870g and sports a mark and manufacturing clues that would place it around 1960. Sadly, I tend to travel light and so rarely use the pair even though I'd tell anyone who asks that they're the best hats I own. Shrug.
 

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afwdrums

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awesome! I've been looking for one of those 15" bottoms too...you surely don't want to trade, but if for some reason you'd rather have a 14 than that 15, I have 2 different Pre-Trans 14's for you to choose from, same style hammering on both
 

Franklin Nigel Stein

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While tempting, these are my only pair of 15s. I sort of use them on special occasions. Throw up a pic or two of your 14s.

On this type of 15, I’ve seen (I think) two of the pre-war and one Trans stamp in the last 3-4 years. And I bought one of the earlies for 75 bucks.

Ya just gotta watch for them faithfully. You’ll get there.
 

afwdrums

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all good man, considering you called them "the best hats I own" I knew it was a very long shot, but you never know unless you ask!

I don't have photos of just my 14's, but here's 2 pics of my whole Pre-Trans family...20/18/16/14/14/14 (and I've since added another 18)...the 14 that is closest is quite thin (it's a later Pre-Trans), the next 2 are both pretty beefy (in an awesome way)...they all have that amazing heavy hammering
First Stamps_web.jpg
First Stamps-backs_web.jpg
 

Franklin Nigel Stein

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all good man, considering you called them "the best hats I own" I knew it was a very long shot, but you never know unless you ask!

I don't have photos of just my 14's, but here's 2 pics of my whole Pre-Trans family...20/18/16/14/14/14 (and I've since added another 18)...the 14 that is closest is quite thin (it's a later Pre-Trans), the next 2 are both pretty beefy (in an awesome way)...they all have that amazing heavy hammering
View attachment 518948 View attachment 518949
I had a 16 that I sold maybe a year ago. Could not find a top to match it plus they were waaaay too expensive.

edit - should also mention that I once owned a 12 and a 13, both with WWII type military stamps added. Each was about 1/4 inch oversized so it was a bit impractical to use them as hats.
 
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Cliff DeArment

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A bit before the pandemic, one of my internet drum email guys (I'm starting a new term, I-deg) read my complaint that I couldn't find a certain kind of sound that could only be found in a marriage between old A/K Zildjian and early New Beat hi-hat cymbals. He sent me a picture and said that I should look around for one of these early A. Zildjian cymbals to use as a bottom hi-hat, and the rest would take care of itself. This one is a 15in early A. Zildjian c.1935 that weighs in at 1454g. Really and Truly, this cymbal shouldn't be this good, but it turns itself into half of an incredible pair of dark/smooth/sweet/NewBeat-like hi-hats.

I've seen this type of large / deep hammering on some heavy 1930s Zildjians as well as a few trans stamp examples, and in sizes from 12 to 16 inches in diameter. It seems likely that all those large diameter impact marks cancel out the higher frequencies coming down from the top

Do us all a solid and share a bit of your personal cymbal knowledge and good fortune (ah-winkwink).

What have you stumbled onto that would really help someone else's search for "THAT" special sound?
This bell type is early 30's. Stamp matches as well. By weight, most likely marching band.
 

Franklin Nigel Stein

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This bell type is early 30's. Stamp matches as well. By weight, most likely marching band.
marching band was what I was thinking as well. Some extra information is that the edge doesn’t get as thin as you’d expect for a early 30s on-bass-drum or hanging cymbal. Alone it’s to much of a bell imho. It just excels now at a job it was never intended for.
 

Deafmoon

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I had one of those back in the 70’s. Super heavy 15”. Sold it about 48 years ago.
 

ThomasL

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My favorite (and only) heavier hi-hat bottom is a Paiste SC Dark Heavy Top(!) at 1136 g. I tried many A's (1080, 1177, 1256, 1282 g) before I found this one and they all made the foot splash clangy to some degree. The SC makes the chick stronger but there is no clang in the foot splash. Not sure if it's the hammering, the lower profile, or the low-pitched bell, but it just works.
 

ChicagoDave

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all good man, considering you called them "the best hats I own" I knew it was a very long shot, but you never know unless you ask!

I don't have photos of just my 14's, but here's 2 pics of my whole Pre-Trans family...20/18/16/14/14/14 (and I've since added another 18)...the 14 that is closest is quite thin (it's a later Pre-Trans), the next 2 are both pretty beefy (in an awesome way)...they all have that amazing heavy hammering
View attachment 518948 View attachment 518949
That 20" is pretty stunning.
 

afwdrums

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That 20" is pretty stunning.
thanks man, it's my crown jewel...I was going to post a link to this old thread with more photos of the 20" for you to see, but you're already on that thread, you've got some nice cymbals too!
 
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