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Buddy Rich soloing

Slingerland79

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Hello, can any jazz drummers on here help me out? The tune is Zoot Sims and Buddy Rich, "Somebody Loves Me". The youtube link

Can anyone tell me how Buddy's solos are counted throughout the song, or is he soloing to his liking and signaling to the band when to jump back in?

If anyone would be kind enough to listen to the tune and give their thoughts, I'd appreciate it. Thank you!
 

JDA

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He's Playing chorus
Then 8s
then takes an ending don't know what you'd call it Coda (stanza constanza maybe ) of measured bars

Yes It's form (of the tune) playing; all within the bar lines of the song--- no free willey

I might have gotten first solo break and other number of measure wrong. Tune is very fast and I listened thru once.

edit: my thoughts are gathered in the following post
 
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JDA

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32 bar song
quarter note is around 304 bpm ( estimate


Bud's first solo 1:58 is 32 bars long; the song's form
Following are 8s Trading 8s at 2:30
Twice

Then at 3:18 Bud does that "constanza (I'll call it" ending
solo of 18 bars total .

16+2 bars

the 2 may be shave and a hair cut two bits.
Yes confirmed.
 
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Slingerland79

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@Slingerland79 Great song thx for bringing attention
ps. hi hat intro is 8 bars
Thanks for your time and help. Is there a way to practice soloing over those various bars? How does he not get lost? If you know of any play along jazz dvds for drummers that you could recommend, please do so.
 

Slingerland79

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32 bar song
quarter note is around 304 bpm ( estimate


Bud's first solo 1:58 is 32 bars long; the song's form
Following are 8s Trading 8s at 2:30
Twice

Then at 3:18 Bud does that "constanza (I'll call it" ending
solo of 18 bars total .

16+2 bars

the 2 may be shave and a hair cut two bits.
Yes confirmed.
I'm probably not as musically educated as you and it's been years since I formally studied drums. I lost you on the "2 may be shace and a hair cut two bits".... Sorry if I'm asking too many questions! I appreciate it.
 

JDA

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I'm probably not as musically educated as you and it's been years since I formally studied drums. I lost you on the "2 may be shace and a hair cut two bits".... Sorry if I'm asking too many questions! I appreciate it.
the solo at the end
is 16 bars plus he adds 2 bars.. an almost comical rhythm bit

ever watch Benny Hill? " shave and a hair cut two bits is a rhythmic Musical figure)
How about " Laugh In"?
"Da da da.. da da.. da. tiss"

Bud adds those 2 comic bars to finish the tune off.
16+2 bars
the last 2 bars is the comical figure
 
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JDA

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As far as feeling 8 and 4 and 16 and 8 bars, chorus, verses, bridges total 32 bar songs you just have to feel it.

Watch old B&W movies. Try "42nd Street" the (1935) movie
Search out ( "google") AABA and song forms. AABA = 32 bar form =verse/verse/bridge/verse =8888= back to the top.
Structure.
It's a tradition in the entertainment/dance/stage/ industry since Tin Pan Alley Broadway etc
1920s 30s up to today

Feel it; sense it; then you'll be able to count it; to prove yourself correct; in what you're assessing.
But it's grasping a natural even feeling 1st. When you start counting you begin to realize-see- 80% of - many songs are 8888 AABA
 
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Slingerland79

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As far as feeling 8 and 4 and 16 and 8 bars, chorus, verses, bridges total 32 bar songs you just have to feel it.

Watch old B&W movies. Try "42nd Street" the (1935) movie
Search out ( "google") AABA and song forms. AABA = 32 bar form =verse/verse/bridge/verse =8888= back to the top.
Structure.
It's a tradition in the entertainment/dance/stage/ industry since Tin Pan Alley Broadway etc
1920s 30s up to today

Feel it; sense it; then you'll be able to count it; to prove yourself correct; in what you're assessing.
But it's grasping a natural even feeling 1st. When you start counting you begin to realize-see- 80% of - many songs are 8888 AABA
Thanks so much for all that. Will definitely google and seek out all that you mentioned. Appreciate your help!
 

Slingerland79

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As far as feeling 8 and 4 and 16 and 8 bars, chorus, verses, bridges total 32 bar songs you just have to feel it.

Watch old B&W movies. Try "42nd Street" the (1935) movie
Search out ( "google") AABA and song forms. AABA = 32 bar form =verse/verse/bridge/verse =8888= back to the top.
Structure.
It's a tradition in the entertainment/dance/stage/ industry since Tin Pan Alley Broadway etc
1920s 30s up to today

Feel it; sense it; then you'll be able to count it; to prove yourself correct; in what you're assessing.
But it's grasping a natural even feeling 1st. When you start counting you begin to realize-see- 80% of - many songs are 8888 AABA

 

dcrigger

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Thanks so much for all that. Will definitely google and seek out all that you mentioned. Appreciate your help!
Everything JDA wrote is spot on - I would only add....

Being able to feel these things doesn't just come with immersion.... though immersion is absolutely necessary. There's also awareness.... specifically "counting". IMO don't ever, ever be afraid to count... count bars, count phrases, count groups of four groups of eight... consciously keep track of which section of AABA you're in.

Again - my opinion - but don't expect "feeling it" to come from osmosis... make it happen through awareness. Count and count and count some more... and with enough immersion from listening to, playing along with songs of these styles... it will all start becoming second nature.

I don't ever decide not to count - I just find I don't count when I don't need to - as soon the need arises (and it still does arise often), then the counting is right there - seemingly already happening in my head.
 

JDA

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Yes I meant once you count it often enough the number and the feel can become one ; I meant. Now dealing with unusual writing and original music or exploring new to you music good Yes to keep your counting Hat on. (as I did with the Zoot Sim song above
Thanks Dave for a change : )
ps. That song above was so fast I had to quickly devise - shift to - a quick way of counting- don't give up (!
4 beats was going by fast! 1234 2234 3234...
 
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Slingerland79

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Thanks again. I'm paying more attention to the count and I do it with everything I listen to. It's starting to break down. Not as impossible as it felt in the beginning!
 
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Slingerland79

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Yes I meant once you count it often enough the number and the feel can become one ; I meant. Now dealing with unusual writing and original music or exploring new to you music good Yes to keep your counting Hat on. (as I did with the Zoot Sim song above
Thanks Dave for a change : )
ps. That song above was so fast I had to quickly devise - shift to - a quick way of counting- don't give up (!
4 beats was going by fast! 1234 2234 3234...

At the 3:43 mark of the song, that solo break, how is it counted? Thanks for your time.
 

toddbishop

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Is there a way to practice soloing over those various bars? How does he not get lost? If you know of any play along jazz dvds for drummers that you could recommend, please do so.

That's a jazz drummer's entire job-- know tunes, know forms, know how to play 4 and 8 bar phrases. Tunes are the basic environment and orientation for that entire field of music, so you have to be thinking in those terms all the time.

Listen to and play along with any jazz record, any jazz drummer. Google lists of famous jazz records, jazz drummers, and common tunes. Start paying attention to what tune you're hearing, be able to sing it, figure out how long the form is. When you practice jazz stuff, do everything in four and eight bar phrases. Play with people a lot so you're always learning tunes.

Beyond that you would need to take some lessons.
 

Slingerland79

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That's a jazz drummer's entire job-- know tunes, know forms, know how to play 4 and 8 bar phrases. Tunes are the basic environment and orientation for that entire field of music, so you have to be thinking in those terms all the time.

Listen to and play along with any jazz record, any jazz drummer. Google lists of famous jazz records, jazz drummers, and common tunes. Start paying attention to what tune you're hearing, be able to sing it, figure out how long the form is. When you practice jazz stuff, do everything in four and eight bar phrases. Play with people a lot so you're always learning tunes.

Beyond that you would need to take some lessons.

A few lessons with a good teacher that's into this kind of music would be a good idea.
 


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