Can I reduce the heavy wash of a very heavy ride (holes, putty, chewing gum, I dunno)

JDA

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yes note the request the weight bet few medium thins were sold
but they'd sure be special.
 

multijd

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I’ve seen one (or more) of these that have a bit of a flange also. Same as pictured but maybe 2-4” from the edge before it curves back there is an additional “ridge” in the plate. I think it is at one of the schools where I teach. I’ll try to remember to take a photo next week when I’m there.

Also I would experiment with stacking some other things on it or mounting upside down and filling it like a tray with different items.
 

Deafmoon

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Sell it first, don’t screw it up! Then get what you want, a heavy dry ride.
 

OldSticks

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1st of all Much Love JM I don't believe those were brass... They were...as the Zildjian cymbal of the time was. B20.

the only guy that comes to mind that mounted a gong flat and rode it was
Fredy Studer Paiste artist. (it was a Paiste..)

Thank you, you're absolutely correct, bronze, not brass. Very cool on the Fredy Studer reference. I'll look into that, maybe I can hear that ride.
 

OldSticks

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Sell it first, don’t screw it up! Then get what you want, a heavy dry ride.
Kim at Zildjian said a couple sold for $250/$300, "but they were looking for them. I hear you, and I'll weigh my options before I make any permanent changes. I'm a player, not a collector.The clear ping is a beautiful sound, clear and a bit like a bell. I've never heard a cymbal sound anything like that (and I'm old). The ride actually sounds washy but OK, the sustain is awful. thanx for your feedback
 

OldSticks

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I’ve seen one (or more) of these that have a bit of a flange also. Same as pictured but maybe 2-4” from the edge before it curves back there is an additional “ridge” in the plate. I think it is at one of the schools where I teach. I’ll try to remember to take a photo next week when I’m there.

Also I would experiment with stacking some other things on it or mounting upside down and filling it like a tray with different items.
thank you, good ideas. The enter 12" is on a slightly higher plane (maybe 3/8' or 1/2". Maybe a berm, but not a ridge. I loved the Fredy Studer solo video
very cool, thank you.
So 18" is an omission from the Zildjian models document. Thanks Joe. I know there are omissions because I've found 6 or 7 others.

Given that the user can specify weight desired, this 18" in question might have been ordered Extra Heavy.
Thank you
 

OldSticks

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These B20 gongs have been around since at least 1949. The WFL 1949 catalog gives prices

View attachment 488151

Did you buy it brand new in 1980 or could it have been older? From what I'm seeing it might be late 1950s but without some better quality photos or hands on it is hard to be sure.

I haven't ever seen a Gong (also called Tam Tam) that small. I've recorded them from 22" to 28" and 1949 (T2 stamp) to the 1970s and have yet to see an 18". According to the Zildjian models history they haven't produced an 18", although that could be an omission. Gongs are all 20" or larger until 1998 when they came out with a few mini gongs (10", 12" 15").

The weight 2612g is extra heavy for an 18" diameter cymbal (gong or otherwise). They get up to 2300g for a Band or Concert cymbal from the late 1970s. Any chance your weight measurement was inaccurate? Or perhaps a problem with conversion from pounds to grams? Just curious. Extra heavy cymbals do tend to have lots of sustain so I can imagine what you are up against getting the sound you want.
 

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I'm very confident on the weight (I'll double check, tho, and tell you if I find it different), and my scale is metric. If it's extra heavy, that might help explain the huge wash, maybe? June 1980 I ordered 6 Pearl concert toms, with "power shells" still my babies. I bought this gong, and bought a Tama Bell Brass snare. I was conned out of the Bell Brass, very sad about that. I know who did it! He still lives here in South Bend. I'd tell you all his name, but I'm sure that wouldn't be appropriate for the forum. I'll be OK, but it really p*sses me off. Sorry, I went off on a rant. The gong was brand new, from a music store in Pontiac, MI. Thanks very much for your interest and help. JM
 

OldSticks

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These B20 gongs have been around since at least 1949. The WFL 1949 catalog gives prices

View attachment 488151

Did you buy it brand new in 1980 or could it have been older? From what I'm seeing it might be late 1950s but without some better quality photos or hands on it is hard to be sure.

I haven't ever seen a Gong (also called Tam Tam) that small. I've recorded them from 22" to 28" and 1949 (T2 stamp) to the 1970s and have yet to see an 18". According to the Zildjian models history they haven't produced an 18", although that could be an omission. Gongs are all 20" or larger until 1998 when they came out with a few mini gongs (10", 12" 15").

The weight 2612g is extra heavy for an 18" diameter cymbal (gong or otherwise). They get up to 2300g for a Band or Concert cymbal from the late 1970s. Any chance your weight measurement was inaccurate? Or perhaps a problem with conversion from pounds to grams? Just curious. Extra heavy cymbals do tend to have lots of sustain so I can imagine what you are up against getting the sound you want.
All good input, I really appreciate you help and expertise
 

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If you want to use it as a ride, it seems that the best option would be to send it to a cymbal smith and let him/her customize it for you. My understanding is that they can re-lathe and hammer to create what want and like to work with Zildjian B20.
Wow, I'd like to learn more about that. How and where? I'm not far from Chicago. I could ship it elsewhere. I don't know what I could ask for, not familiar with cymbal smithing, but I'm going to learn. thanx very much
 

OldSticks

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I'd start with some painter's tape. Won't leave residue and easy to remove/reposition. I would not mod the gong......seems cool and sell-able.....
Thank you. I'll keep learning more about the options. I won't go with any mod till I'm a lot more certain and confident. I don't know if I can sell it (not for $300 anyway). I've had that chunk of bronze for 40 years. thanx again
 

OldSticks

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hang- something that bounces- up and down- to shorten the note but not alter the tone.
Something make something like this:


you want to dampen not stifle
Please help me a little more there. Like a tennis ball, a piece of rubber or fabric. I think you may have given me a link. I'm a cyber dinosaur, I'll see if I can open it. Thank you very much
 

OldSticks

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The first thought I had was cutting and mounting a foam disc (or square, any shape actually) underneath this plate on the stand. I don't know how thick the foam would need to be... whatever shortens the roar to a manageable amount. Using foam, you wouldn't need to do any work on the cymbal or alter its Turkish gongness. I wouldn't want to take a piece like that out of its original form.
Very good. I can try many variations, cheap, without any damage or permanent change. thanx
 

Matched Gripper

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Wow, I'd like to learn more about that. How and where? I'm not far from Chicago. I could ship it elsewhere. I don't know what I could ask for, not familiar with cymbal smithing, but I'm going to learn. thanx very much
It seems some of the more well known cymbal smiths (Spizzochino, Skiba), have passed away. I don’t think it’s a hazardous profession, but . . . ?

Others I’ve read about are Jesse Simpson out of Brooklyn, and Matt Bettis who is a DFO member. They both have websites and youtube channels if you want to contact them and ask what they can do for you and at what price.
 

JDA

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Please help me a little more there. Like a tennis ball, a piece of rubber or fabric. I think you may have given me a link. I'm a cyber dinosaur, I'll see if I can open it. Thank you very much
Something you can hang...of the stem....when you mount the gong....as a ride cymbal position..

Material like a leather square...felt patch..etc on a string or piece of twine

 

wraub

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Short term, I'd suggest a small piece of Moongel, or gaff tape. Or, perhaps, try to strike it differetly. I have a 60s Zildjian 22" ride that has a roar that can quickly dominate everything, but learning to approach it with more grace has it playing along much more nicely. ;)

I, personally, would be hesitant to mod your gong for keeps, but maybe contact Saluda Cymbals. I've heard they can cut and lathe pieces for people.
 

Tommy D

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Meinl makes these magnets that are designed to dry out cymbals. Depending on where you place them (near the center hole or near the edge) will determine the amount of sustain that is cut. if you don't like the idea of metal on metal contact, I recommend Drum Tacs. They are better than moon gel as they can be mounted on the under side of the cymbal and they don't lose their grip or dry out over time.
 

KevinD

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I saw those Meinl magnets advertised..thought they were interesting.. Shortly thereafter I was in a hardware store and noticed they had a lot of the same kind of magnets (various shapes and sizes) but also magnetic strips and other things that could be cut to size.. I picked up a bunch of different kinds for a total of about $8.. (figuring I could always use them around the house for something).
Every now and then I'll put a few on to see what they do and how well they do it... They seem to cut the overtones down but then I realized that none of my cymbals are that ringy to the point they need taming... but you get some cool and different sounds depending on which ones you use.. below is one similar to one of the items I picked up... I would also 2nd the suggestion of using gaffer tape. you can apply it straight or in the raised ribbon shape to see what works best..

 


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