Confirmed: DW sold to Roland

[benobriensmith]

Well of course you have to sell people on them. That’s something DW is fully capable of.

Sorry, that much was lost in the post I quoted from you. I've also yet to see DW revive a brand in the way that would be necessary with Slingerland.

 

[Mcjnic]

None of the Slingerland / DW talk made sense to me.

There's already a company making shells like Slingerland did ... and doing a fine job of it.
The hardware can be had (repro) on the cheap via quite a few sites.
Steve (used to?/still does?) makes/made the Slingerland mounts and such ... or you can just hit the cannibal market.
It wouldn't take much to build a "real" Slingerland kit.

But honestly ... the oddest variable in all this is the many many many Slingerland kits for sale ... everywhere.
Why wouldn't a person simply purchase an actual Slingerland kit on the used market?
There's a ton of them out there in very good to fantastic shape.

The hardware couldn't be much of an issue these days ... what with all the aftermarket mount workarounds and such.

...

I just don't get it.

 

[Houndog]

They’re outrageous priced and the company isn’t very responsive to inquiries.

New Slingerlands wouldn’t be much cheaper …..if any .

 

[benobriensmith]

Why wouldn't a person simply purchase an actual Slingerland kit on the used market?
There's a ton of them out there in very good to fantastic shape.

This same argument could be used with Gretsch or Ludwig. Not everyone is looking for something used. Plenty of people want the old aesthetic with the brand new finish.

 

[1988fxlr]

None of the Slingerland / DW talk made sense to me.

There's already a company making shells like Slingerland did ... and doing a fine job of it.
The hardware can be had (repro) on the cheap via quite a few sites.
Steve (used to?/still does?) makes/made the Slingerland mounts and such ... or you can just hit the cannibal market.
It wouldn't take much to build a "real" Slingerland kit.

But honestly ... the oddest variable in all this is the many many many Slingerland kits for sale ... everywhere.
Why wouldn't a person simply purchase an actual Slingerland kit on the used market?
There's a ton of them out there in very good to fantastic shape.

The hardware couldn't be much of an issue these days ... what with all the aftermarket mount workarounds and such.

...

I just don't get it.

I’d say there is a profitable market for some runs of single ply snares under the Slingerland name. Otherwise I don’t get it either. Maybe a replacement strainer that is a direct swap with a zoomatic and an updated set o matic could find some buyers too but full kits that would realistically need to cost 3 or 4 times the market rate for nice Vintage seems a hard sell

 

[Houndog]

This same argument could be used with Gretsch or Ludwig. Not everyone is looking for something used. Plenty of people want the old aesthetic with the brand new finish.

Kind of , old Gretsch and Ludwig go for about double a similar Slingerland kit does .
So why buy old Ludwig and Gretsch when you can get new for a bit more ..

 

[JimmyM]

Sorry, that much was lost in the post I quoted from you. I've also yet to see DW revive a brand in the way that would be necessary with Slingerland.

Well you’re more plugged into the scene than most, and certainly way better connected than I am. But I really do think there’s hope for it to come back if they do it right. Don’s plan of starting with Radio King single ply snares is a good one IMHO.

 

[1988fxlr]

Kind of , old Gretsch and Ludwig go for about double a similar Slingerland kit does .
So why buy old Ludwig and Gretsch when you can get new for a bit more ..

And new Ludwigs go for 2/3 to 3/4 what new DW go for

 

[Houndog]

I think Slingerland Sound King Series kits would have been the way to go and offer Chrome and Blackchrome as well ..

 

[Houndog]

And new Ludwigs go for 2/3 to 3/4 what new DW go for

But that’s not the conversation at hand ?

 

[benobriensmith]

But I really do think there’s hope for it to come back if they do it right. Don’s plan of starting with Radio King single ply snares is a good one IMHO.

I agree that there's hope if it's done right but doing it right also means breaking the mold that they've been part of / have helped establish. I don't think that dipping their toes in the water with just a snare would be the right move here though. I believe they'd need to go all in for an effective relaunch. I'd love to see them really nail it.

That said, it sounds like the focus is going to be elsewhere for a period of time.

 

[1988fxlr]

But that’s not the conversation at hand ?

I brought it up as relevant to guessing the prices of new Slingerlands to be built in DW’s facilities. The presumed distance in price between good vintage Slingerlands and new Slingerlands would be even wider than vintage and new Ludwig, unless they intended to use Slingerland as a means of offering a more affordable american range similar in pricing to classic maples

 

[Russian Dragon]

I'm trying to figure out what's going on with the LH crash stand. Does it have 6 legs?

Or is it a separate stand for the tom? I've zoomed in, and man, it's MC Escher-ing my brain a bit.

This is a screencap from the online magazine. https://www.moderndrummer.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/05/md10.pdf
Not sure if it's higher-res than the ad, but it sure looks like a it has an added flat base, as suggested.

Pretty good idea, actually. I can see a use for such a thing, especially as an option to add to a regular stand. A permanent 6-legger would be a nightmare to fold, but an 'add-on' flat base might be handy on occasion.
I might mess around with some old hardware to see if I can fashion myself one.

 

[flatwins]

After watching the video of Lombardi receiving ownership of Slingerland, he was like a kid on Christmas morning. My theory is that since he’s receiving a substantial payout from the sale of his life’s work we will see him step away from DW but I don’t think he’s done yet. As elated as he is over Slingerland I see him definitely putting some effort into its resurrection. Similar to having a classic car in the garage just waiting for restoration “one of these days after I retire”.

 

[lossforgain]

Yup.
And Diamond
And Nashville-era Slingerland
And WFLIII

TONS of people making good drums. That’s table stakes, and in no way guarantees anything.

WFLIII seems to be doing okay, got a lot of drums out with touring artists anyway. Nashville Slingerland and the Diamond stuff was all super high priced when new, which I know is what you’re saying, but I don’t think the Diamond series was given enough time.

 

[K.O.]

In regards to a revived Slingerland I would say that Gibson proved conclusively that there was not a big market for a hyper-expensive revival of the brand. Maybe at a reasonable price there could be a market. Perhaps at a Renown level price point. But again such a line would cannibalize sales from Gretsch, PDP, and DW performance series drums.

I can see Radio King snares doing well since that name is right up there with Black Beauty as far as having historic mojo. They'll need to do something with the brands to keep the trademarks in force. I guess we'll see at some point.

 

[benobriensmith]

In regards to a revived Slingerland I would say that Gibson proved conclusively that there was not a big market for a hyper-expensive revival of the brand. Maybe at a reasonable price there could be a market. Perhaps at a Renown level price point. But again such a line would cannibalize sales from Gretsch, PDP, and DW performance series drums.

I think the key would be to differentiate the line(s) significantly from what may exist within their current set of brands and sub-brands. There are plenty of ways to ensure that you're not cannibalizing sales. I don't think the customer that's going for PDP or DW Performance is necessarily considering Slingerland. If it were my brand, I'd use it to go after the boutique brands out there today because there are plenty of customers who don't have any interest in a modern line from DW or Gretsch.

 

[type85]

It was hard finding a dealer to order my Classic Maples in 2002 and I’d never seen one in person at the time. Ludwigs visibility was a bit better though. They still seemed to be selling plenty of marching and concert stuff to schools and Alex Van Halen on the inside cover of Modern Drummer was at least recognizable.

I didn't have an issue when I catalog ordered my Ludwigs in 2001, of course it helped that I bought them from the Pro Drum shop in Hollywood, probably the west coast's most renown Ludwig dealer!

 

[mkelley]

New Slingerlands wouldn’t be much cheaper …..if any .

Based on what internal Rolandw or dealer documentation? Im with you on a lot of things. Whatever happens with the three brands, we won’t recognize this shaping until it’s done.

They’ve witnessed what Johnny C/Fred Gretsch, Ronn D, etc had to deal with in their projects. I would suspect a lot of due diligence happened before Roland and the Lombardi’s officially spoke.

 

[type85]

Before the Kaman deal Gretsch was basically a Boutique brand with a storied heritage and a nationally recognized brand name. But there were, like, 6 employees in total, and dealers were few and far between. Their relatively expensive drums were generally custom built to order (hence the "USA Custom" monicker). Still fantastic drums, of course, but with a kind of a low profile, long wait times, and almost no sets in stock in stores for anyone to see. Very little advertising other than a rotating slate of out of date ads running in MD. They were successful in that they were selling all the drums they could build (and then some) but nearly all of those sales were to older drummers who remembered the glory years while up and coming drummers barely knew of the brand.

The Kaman deal changed all that, suddenly there were different tiers of Gretsch drums at different price points out in the stores and fresh new ads everywhere. The name was out there and they became a "major" again. The top line drums continued more or less as before, but overall interest in the brand was invigorated and they haven't looked back since. They became fashionable again and have retained that aura for the past 20 years.

Wasn't there a period in the early 90's where Gretsch had to stop using oil based lacquers/paint and switch to water based? Or they had to buy an extensive fume hood system to trap the vapours when they were painting the drums?
I heard this nearly put them out of business.
This is a story I heard 30 years ago so I might have it wrong!