Cymbal prices getting out of hand ?

Mcjnic

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Greed is a wily one to reign in.
Zildjian cymbals used are creeping up. I still don’t understand that. They were the old stacks that I would go through to find maybe one good one amidst the numerous duds. Hard to find a nice sounding/feeling old Zildjian. They prided themselves on inconsistent cymbals, if you recall.
And yet, here we are.
The prices continue to climb.

Another example ...
The Supra ... a ridiculous number produced for students and added to almost every kit Ludwig sold in the 70s and even into the 80s.
More exist than there are shoppers looking, I would imagine.
The last two or three I picked up used were well under a hundred.
Then the discussions began in earnest online.
Ludwig caught up.
Once the flow of that tide began, the prices online from home sellers went up.
Today, 250 (or more) is a common price.
New ones are above what a premium would normally bring.

It is amazing what online discussion and shrewd marketing can accomplish.
I don’t like the Supra. I picked them up as gifts for friends. Not these days, though.
 
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jaymandude

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Greed is a wily one to reign in.
Zildjian cymbals used are creeping up. I still don’t understand that. They were the old stacks that I would go through to find maybe one good one amidst the numerous duds. Hard to find a nice sounding/feeling old Zildjian. They prided themselves on inconsistent cymbals, if you recall.
And yet, here we are.
The prices continue to climb.

Another example ...
The Supra ... a ridiculous number produced for students and added to almost every kit Ludwig sold in the 70s and even into the 80s.
More exist than there are shoppers looking, I would imagine.
The last two or three I picked up used were well under a hundred.
Then the discussions began in earnest online.
Ludwig caught up.
Once the flow of that tide began, the prices online from home sellers went up.
Today, 250 (or more) is a common price.
New ones are above what a premium would normally bring.

It is amazing what online discussion and shrewd marketing can accomplish.
I don’t like the Supra. I picked them up as gifts for friends. Not these days, though.
Yeah, it's hard not to resist buying every clean supra you can find for 250 and under.
 

Evdoggydog15

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I wonder if any of this also has to do with the prices online marketplaces are charging, like Reverb. I sold a cymbal on Reverb the other day, and when you factor in taxes, shipping, fees...it's pretty rough. Tax remittance? So they're charging sales tax to the buyer AND taking the tax from me as the seller. Maybe I never noticed but that seems new to me.
 

Ox Han

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First of all, I'm not sure that cymbal prices have gotten higher, at least over the long term. Adjusted for inflation, I can buy a new Zildjian today for less than I paid in the 60s.

Second of all, we need to understand that today we have a monopoly retailer (Amazon) setting prices. Those who sell on Amazon are forbidden from selling at lower prices off Amazon, while Amazon takes a commission for sales through its site. Retailers can and do opt out of Amazon, but you can bet that they keep their eyes glued on Amazon's prices.

These points made, I too have bought directly from Turkey, well, via Reverb, and thought those prices lower. Then you're cutting out all but one middleman.
Amazon may be a monopoly in some ways, but not in the cymbal market. There are many, many places to buy cymbals. Three really good examples of Turkish sellers maximizing market channels are Sounds Anatolia, Cymbal Crash, and Cymbal Paradise. All sell on Amazon and Reverb. Generally they offer cheaper prices on Reverb with the "make an offer" feature enabled.

Other than Amazon you can find new cymbals on Reverb, Ebay, GC, bad person, Sweetwater, Drum shop websites like Memphis Drum Shop, Dales Drum Shop, Daytona Drum Center, Boston Drum Center, Drum Center of Portsmouth, Craiglist for used....etc...
 

Ox Han

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I wonder if any of this also has to do with the prices online marketplaces are charging, like Reverb. I sold a cymbal on Reverb the other day, and when you factor in taxes, shipping, fees...it's pretty rough. Tax remittance? So they're charging sales tax to the buyer AND taking the tax from me as the seller. Maybe I never noticed but that seems new to me.
Wrong. Tax is charged separately and not taken out of your portion
 

Evdoggydog15

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Wrong. Tax is charged separately and not taken out of your portion
Sorry, but I believe you're wrong.

Total Sales:$211.10USD
Total Processing Fees:-$5.95USD
Total Selling Fees:-$9.75USD
Total Tax Remitted:-$16.10USD

My recent sale...this varies state by state so it's possible you live in a US state or country that is not doing this. My final payout was $179.30.
 

Ox Han

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Sorry, but I believe you're wrong.

Total Sales:$211.10USD
Total Processing Fees:-$5.95USD
Total Selling Fees:-$9.75USD
Total Tax Remitted:-$16.10USD

My recent sale...this varies state by state so it's possible you live in a US state or country that is not doing this. My final payout was $179.30.
From reverb. Here’s the link and a quote at bottom.


“If you are a Reverb seller in a Marketplace Facilitator state where Reverb collects and pays sales tax on your orders, you do not need to collect or remit sales taxes for your Reverb sales.

Reverb will automatically collect sales tax for items purchased in Marketplace Facilitator states. It will not be possible for you to opt of this collection practice. The upside is that you will not have to take any additional action. There are no charges or fees for Reverb automatically calculating, collecting, and remitting sales tax.”
 

Ox Han

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Sorry, but I believe you're wrong.

Total Sales:$211.10USD
Total Processing Fees:-$5.95USD
Total Selling Fees:-$9.75USD
Total Tax Remitted:-$16.10USD

My recent sale...this varies state by state so it's possible you live in a US state or country that is not doing this. My final payout was $179.30.
What did you list/sell the cymbal for?And are you in the US?

$211.10 is a very odd price. Are you sure you didn’t sell the item for $195?

5% of $195 is $9.75 which is exactly what reverb took. I think you’ve misunderstood this breakdown and didn’t realize tax was collected in addition to the sale price to be collected on your behalf. I believe Tax was added to what you sold it for equaling 211.10.
 
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Ox Han

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What did you list/sell the cymbal for?And are you in the US?

$211.10 is a very odd price. Are you sure you didn’t sell the item for $195?

5% of $195 is $9.75 which is exactly what reverb took. I think you’ve misunderstood this breakdown and didn’t realize tax was collected in addition to the sale price to be collected on your behalf. I believe Tax was added to what you sold it for equaling 211.10.
Looks like $16.11 is about 8.25% of $195. That appears to be a sales tax of CA which is 8.25%. Was the buyer located in CA?
 

Evdoggydog15

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Yeah, you are right. I misread the statement and wasn't really paying attention. Final sale price was $195...Texas purchase.
 

Tdipaul

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If "lumber" includes the type of wood used for shells, drums might have some steep increases very soon...

 

Tdipaul

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"Many Companies are eliminating the distributors as a cost saving measure but they are not saving the Consumer any money. A fine example is Sabian, they eliminate their distributor and sell direct too dealers. The profit margin the distributors had was just swallowed up by Sabian"

Has this been confirmed? Sabian could be selling to the dealer at the same price they were selling to the distributor or somewhere in between, especially to the high volume dealers out there.

But I get your point that the Consumer is not benefiting from the change.
 

Deafmoon

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I am seeing used cymbals that are 20 years old being priced higher than they were when they were new. It’s crazy. I feel for the young drummers who would buy Zildjian, Sabian or Paiste just to have one in their set. But it’s tough to come up with $2 plus bills for a used pie when you are 13 years old.
 

stevesmithfan

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I only buy used I can’t member the last time I bought new. Some of these idiots asked way too much for used product on Reverb for a year or two before they finally realize they need to lower the price.
 

Phantomlimb777

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There are pretty decent sounds at all price points, the rare and vintage stuff is going to be expensive.
 

TomPotti

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Prices for used gear has definitely gone up.

Cymbals especially are like 20 to 25 percent higher in sale price compared to before the pandemic.

To be honest, it has been a good time to unload gear to recuperate from my gear addiction syndrome. Not a great time to buy used though.

If you are looking to acquire used gear, definitely better to buy local from Facebook, craigslist, etc.
 

Ray Dee Oh King

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They're pretty high brand new. I just paid 397 for a new 19" Sig fast crash about 6 weeks ago. I paid 200 for a near mint used 17" fast crash. 300 for a mint used pair of SE 602 14" hats. I used to be that guy that would only buy new when it came to cymbals because theres no decent music stores around me and I was always worried and sceptical of what would show up at my door buying used. No more though, really nice used cymbals can be had for really good deals to those who are patient and wait. If I were to ever buy brand new again, id probably go with Centent cymbals. They have some really nice lines, and one can get a full set (hats, ride, 2 crashes, a splash and usually some sort of china or ozone) all B20 for the price of some major brand ride cymbals, custom made to your liking.
 

franke

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About ten years ago I had the opportunity to tour the Sabian factory. From my observations, the fuel and electricity required for all those furnaces and machinery was quite likely their greatest expensive apart from labor. That said, the price for copper has been rising steadily for some time now, no doubt driven by worldwide demand for electrical components. In this sense cymbals are highly susceptible to market forces.
 

dboomer

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When a company drops distribution and rep fees they now have to assume the extra labor, salaries and expenses. So they often do it for more control of the market and not for increased profit margin.
 


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