Flat Bearing Edges?

SteveB

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I only know that when trimming some shells I have bench tested some of the them before making the edge and they tuned right up with almost full tone. I, personally don't like a sharp edge; there has to be some meat there so I go with the typical 45 to the interior and a 1/4 round at the outside edge (the Rogers edge). Once I took a drum down to a knife like edge, with just a little sanding and no tone emitted from the drum at all.

Look at a Supra metal edge and how much round over there is...and the drum still projects a great tone at most tensions. My Tempus are 1/8" round over only, like the top of an egg and they sing, so even with such a thin shell its possible to get a full sound without the 45 return.
 

deegeebee

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Canwoods have neat flat edges I have not seen elsewhere. Doubt it is unique, but have always considered them an important part of the Canwood sound. Very sharp angle starting relatively far down the shell and laquered all the way up to narrow flat edge, maybe a ply or two think on thin 5 mm Keller shells. Hard to judge the impact of the edges alone, but it certainly works for these drums, which have a beautiful shell-tone.
20181216_090152.jpg
20181216_090205.jpg
 

Matched Gripper

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I restored another Meazzi kit for a studio and did a sound demo 9 years back. Same shells and square edges.

Thanks! On my earbuds they sound fat and dry tuned fairly low. I wounder how they sound tuned up? Nice playing!
 
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Drumstickdude

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No I just meant rounded edges, as Ive tried to explain i was confusing flat edges with roundover edges, it's two different things I suppose. Both drums are radio kings, But the 60s drum I showed when I first got it did have edges that were pretty flat as confirmed by the fellow who re cut them close to the proper original profile. To me when the edges were flatter I personally did not like the way the drum sounded and it wouldn't tune well, it sounded sloppy, the wires buzzed to much and it wouldn't tune high. It did have a lot of bottom end and midrange tone though. Sorry about the confusion before, -my mistake. This is what happens when Ive stayed up all night drinking!
 
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felis

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I've cut down some toms with a table saw to make them shallower.
Before starting on them with a router, they're completely flat and if you try to use them that way, IMO, they sound like crap - worse than cardboard.
All deadness - no life.

The more the head contacts the edge, the less it's able to vibrate.
That's why they say sharp 45's are lively, and round overs are mellower or warmer.
 

Matched Gripper

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I've cut down some toms with a table saw to make them shallower.
Before starting on them with a router, they're completely flat and if you try to use them that way, IMO, they sound like crap - worse than cardboard.
All deadness - no life.

The more the head contacts the edge, the less it's able to vibrate.
That's why they say sharp 45's are lively, and round overs are mellower or warmer.
If the edges are flat/square, then I would think that the width of the shell, and therefore the amount of edge contact with the head, would have a significant effect on the amount of head dampening occurs.
 

Drumstickdude

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No I just meant rounded edges, as Ive tried to explain i was confusing flat edges with roundover edges, it's two different things I suppose. Both drums are radio kings, But the 60s drum I showed when I first got it did have edges that were pretty flat as confirmed by the fellow who re cut them close to the proper original profile. To me when the edges were flatter I personally did not like the way the drum sounded and it wouldn't tune well, it sounded sloppy, the wires buzzed to much and it wouldn't tune high. It did have a lot of bottom end and midrange tone though. Sorry about the confusion before, -my mistake. This is what happens when Ive stayed up all night drinking!
To anyone still interested!! I've just re edited this cos I made a mess of it. I hope this clears up my post a bit.
 

Paradiddle

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Absolutely 100% flat and square. No round over whatsoever. These drums made me scratch my head about the whole concept and philosphy of edges.
I have a 40's WFL and the rack and floor tom came with square edges. Couldn't get them to stop buzzing with modern heads so I had them fixed. They now have the same profile as the bass drum and snare did from the factory.

Totally square edges was a thing early on because it didn't matter as much with calf heads.
 

SpinaDude

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I think what we're all missing, the real key to all this, is properly sanding the bearing edge to a true flat top. We want this...
Ft 1.jpeg
...providing a rounder, fuller sound.

Improper sanding leads to this marred flat top bearing edge...
FT2.jpg
... leading to retardation of sustain and a limited tuning range.
 

cplueard

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If the edges are flat/square, then I would think that the width of the shell, and therefore the amount of edge contact with the head, would have a significant effect on the amount of head dampening occurs.
I was wondering if someone would point this out while I was reading. Shell thickness would likely have the largest effect on a flat edge.
 
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Talking about bearing edges, we must always take into account the thickness of the shell.
The important factor is the width of the contact area between the shell and the head.
Rolled edges on thin metal shells may be "sharper" than 45 degrees bearing edges on really thick staves.
 

BlackPearl

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I built myself a little kit a few years ago. I put roundover edges on the 12" and 14" inch toms. I intended to do the same on the 20" bass drum, but I assembled it just because I was impatient to see the whole kit put together - and I really like the sound of it - it is fairly warm, but a good amount of tone comes of out of it, to my ears. I have a G1 coated head on the batter, and a unported Fiberskyn on the front, and use a felt strip for muffling. I feel like I should take it apart and put the edges on it, but am afraid I won't like it as much.

My theory is that the edge has less of an effect on the larger drum, but I'm just a hobbist builder. Not even that anymore I guess, as the cost of building, at least here in Canada, is pretty high, and I really don't need any more drums right now ! Though I keep thinking I'd like a matching piccolo snare for the kit ...

Bill
 

Rock Salad

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Canwoods have neat flat edges I have not seen elsewhere. Doubt it is unique, but have always considered them an important part of the Canwood sound. Very sharp angle starting relatively far down the shell and laquered all the way up to narrow flat edge, maybe a ply or two think on thin 5 mm Keller shells. Hard to judge the impact of the edges alone, but it certainly works for these drums, which have a beautiful shell-tone.
View attachment 444036 View attachment 444037
I am about to do some edges. This^ (without my glasses) looks like a thin flat edge with 45s inside and out. Is it? And also, you said you like it right?
 

deegeebee

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I am about to do some edges. This^ (without my glasses) looks like a thin flat edge with 45s inside and out. Is it? And also, you said you like it right?
It is something like that, looks like it could be a sharper angle than 45, but the flat edge is in the centre of the shell. Also seems that the transition between shell and edge is gradual - gently curved rather than straight - if that makes any sense. Might just be that he sands down the corner after cutting the edge and then laquers right up to the flat.

The drums sound superb. Nice tone, nice focus, easy to tune. Not sure how much of that is coming from the edges and how much is coming from the 5 mm shells and cast hoops.
 

shuffle

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Totally square edges was a thing early on because it didn't matter as much with calf heads.
[/QUOTE]
This is what ive always understood about flat edges,with calfskin heads not so much a modern head.
 

Matched Gripper

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I am about to do some edges. This^ (without my glasses) looks like a thin flat edge with 45s inside and out. Is it? And also, you said you like it right?
Assuming that that is a narrow flat edge, it looks like the entire edge was sanded on a table to true the edge to a flat plane, if you follow what I’m saying.

That might render an excellent result, but, that’s not what I’m talking about in the OP. I’m talking about the entire width of the shell being flat.
 

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