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A lot of times I don’t use the filter button when tuning toms/bass drums unless I get a weird reading on a lug then I’ll go to a lug with the more realistic reading and press the button.
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Help Me Choose: Drum Dial or TuneBot
- Thread starter Derrick
- Start date
notINtheband
DFO Veteran
As soon as I get a lug to within a couple hertz of the number I’m looking for, I hit filter, and then it takes care of any errant reading for the rest of the tuning on that head.
LOVE the filter feature!
LOVE the filter feature!
I have a tension watch and a tunebot studio. I've also played around with the Evans torque key in the past. The dials, as mentioned, only deal with lug tension. This is helpful but doesn't account for other variables like, bad edges, uneven heads, sticky threads, bad rods etc. . I'm not a tunebot expert by any means and have found myself a little lost when trying to figure out the devices best uses but through trial and error and the website, have found it a very worthy tool. I can live without it for sure and all my drums typically sound the same through years of tuning but have found some unorthodox settings on the site that I tried and had surprisingly great results with. I tried Dennis Chambers' (one of the few kits with an 8") settings and they worked out really well. The 8 and 10 have lower reso settings than the batter and the 12 and 14, have a higher reso than the batter BUT they sound great!! I've always tuned the reso tighter but this configuration works really, really well.
One tip I would recommend (in addition to making sure the opposing head is muted) is to move the bot to each lug while measuring and using your index finger to keep the same distance from the head at each lug. Rest your finger on the rim and the bot on your finger to keep the distance consistent.
The tune bot is by far the superior tool if we're talking about, a start to finish process, that actually tunes your drums and doesn't just measure tension. Grab one and be patient. I'm sure some really savvy tune bot users can help you too. Here are DCs settings.
One tip I would recommend (in addition to making sure the opposing head is muted) is to move the bot to each lug while measuring and using your index finger to keep the same distance from the head at each lug. Rest your finger on the rim and the bot on your finger to keep the distance consistent.
The tune bot is by far the superior tool if we're talking about, a start to finish process, that actually tunes your drums and doesn't just measure tension. Grab one and be patient. I'm sure some really savvy tune bot users can help you too. Here are DCs settings.
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One of the first things I did when I got my tune-bot studio was try the Dennis Chambers settings out. It was pretty awesome. I did it on my 10, 12, 14, 16, 22, 6.5x14 and got a very beefy, rich sound. The snare really popped too. I think it was with all the stock ambassador heads too.
I own both. The drum dial gets you close really fast, as soon as you sort out the tensions you want. The tune bot will get you bang on every time, but takes a little time to master the device itself. Tune bot wins for me, after the bugs are worked out its just as fast as the drum dial.
OK, I wanted to follow up saying that I decided on the Tune-Bot and recently received it. The instructions ARE very bad and the company's videos are worse. Two questions...
(1) I have a Ludwig with 13" & 18" toms and a 24" kick. I tried the calculator on line and it said to tune both toms to a B and there's no choice to add the kick. So I don't know the proper not to tune the kick in relation to the toms and tuning both toms to the same note... is that right?
(2) When I tried to tune a 14" snare as a test, the snare side almost never showed anything in the 300hz-450hz range no matter how high I made the tension. It didn't matter if I selected "Extended Range" or not. I got so frustrated then watched some more videos where I found one guy put his finger on the center of the snare side to mask the fundemental. That worked, but the Tune-Bot won't read more than a fe lugs away so I have t hold it at each lug, hit the lug with another hand, and press down with a third hand which nobody is born with. Other videos don't seem to require this. Why am I having so much trouble with the Tune-Bot?
(1) I have a Ludwig with 13" & 18" toms and a 24" kick. I tried the calculator on line and it said to tune both toms to a B and there's no choice to add the kick. So I don't know the proper not to tune the kick in relation to the toms and tuning both toms to the same note... is that right?
(2) When I tried to tune a 14" snare as a test, the snare side almost never showed anything in the 300hz-450hz range no matter how high I made the tension. It didn't matter if I selected "Extended Range" or not. I got so frustrated then watched some more videos where I found one guy put his finger on the center of the snare side to mask the fundemental. That worked, but the Tune-Bot won't read more than a fe lugs away so I have t hold it at each lug, hit the lug with another hand, and press down with a third hand which nobody is born with. Other videos don't seem to require this. Why am I having so much trouble with the Tune-Bot?
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I’m leaning towards the Drumdial again. Especially with my DW wood snare drum. I usually like to tune it between G and A with the Tunebot but I always come back to what Steve from Drumdial told me to tune it to which is 88 batter and 82 reso with the Drumdial. When I check the fundamental with the Tunebot it’s an F#. The snare just seems way more natural sounding when I tune it this way and if it needs a little muffling add some moongel or an “O” ring. Also, I think the guys at Drumdial are on the side of “a looser snare side head causes less sympathetic buzz” and not the other side which a lot of us our on. They may have a point. I’ll also add that the suggested settings he gave me make my toms lower in pitch than Tunebot’s suggested settings also which isn’t such a bad thing because each head is tuned to the same tension so the drums sing.
Quai34
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Hi,
I was like you 3 years ago: Keys player, no tuning drums experience but knew a drums kit could be tune with notes. I had asked in the past, in 2015, to my drummer how he was tuning and he dias, I don't know, just trying to find a good sound, then he samhed the head and said, "see, good tone and that's it". The tone was awful and that's why I was asking the question.
I was so bad at tuning or no, so scared at tuning and messing with it that I was asking a friend of mine to help me anytime I need to tune the kit. Ok, he was doing it by ears and feeling but still, something was off for me because:
1) I wanted to tune my drums like a scale and it was making sense that you could do it.
2) I had read that having a 5th or a 4th between heads was a goo way to make tehn resonate which was also making sense due to my knowledge of harmonies.
3) I can recognize a note and any interval in singing it when listening to a song or vocals but was a bit surprised by not hearing a perfect clear note when you struck a Tom.
Ha yes, My kit is a Tama Royal Star 1973, 10"X7", 12X8", 13X9" and 16X16", Maple.
So, I bought the tunebot and I asked also a lot of questions, some people, most of, were nice, some well, just telling me that I should use my ears as I was a keys player. That was right but again, a lot of overtone in a drum, compared to a string of a piano and/or one for guitar and no knowledge to what to start with, what to look for so, first I read and read again all the tune guide, I didn't use the calculator as well because the apps just gives you the notes but explains nothing and I wanted to understand what I was doing.
So, don't use the calculator at first as it gives you sometimes weird proposal and at least for me, almost never an interval between heads, in fact, there is never a 5th or a 4th. Ok, it might work but, as I read a lot about it - I have a binder full of printing of stuff online about tuning - I wanted the intervals to be accurate.
So, I used first the tuning guide:
Tune-Bot | Change the way you tune your drums.
Introducing tune-bot Studio, the new advanced drum tuner from Overtone Labs. Welcome to precision in the palm of your hand.
tune-bot.com
It gives you a lot of exemple, for Toms, snare, Kick etc...Kick for example, is the toughest for me because it's so low, i'm not use to that low in keys and I was not sure to do it well, so, for kick, start with what people say, barely no wrinkle on the batter, a bit tighter on the reso and done, do it after you have learnt properly the tunebot. For instance, I was still asking my friend to come and tell me because i was not sure about the kick...And I have a port so, no way to know if the lug close to the port is good.
Them choose how many drumns you have and check what the examples are: I have 4 Toms, 10, 12, 13 and 16...And that was the first problem, they gave you examples with 12 and 14, not 13.,. Ok, not bad, I will just decided that 13" should be one step down from the 12" or one step up from the 14" and will see. Also, start with the 16" and go up, easier for me, when you sing a scale you start with the lower note, right? when they ask you the notes for a C7, you say, C, E, G and Bb right? you don't start with Bb, so, I did this as well.
In table 1:
Table 1. Recommended Fundamental Notes and Frequencies for Various Tom Configurations (continued)
They say either: 2D, 2G, 2B, 2D or: 2C sharp, 2F sharp, 2B and 3E. Ok, I like my 16" to be low, like a big boom and it was tuned like that with my friend and realized I was at 64/45 hertz, 2C so, I kept 2C at 66, same note for each head to keep the more resonance, then the 2G for the 13" was making sense because it's a 5th up so, I should have a nice tone when I will play them together. Ha yes, print a table of correspondence in hertz and notes like the one below (Link), it will save you sometime, no need to use the tunebot for that.
Also, they were saying 2F sharp for a 14" so, 1/2 step more than it for my 13" was also making sense, so, be it, I choose 2G for my 13", I have to tell that, once you have chosen a tuning, keep it until you have tried all 4 toms together and see if it sounds good to you, if not, change one drum at a time only otherwise you will be too messed up to change too much at a time.
Then, for the 12" I had the choice of...nothing, they were saying both 2B, great, one less issue to think about. then for the 10", 2D or 2E...at 2D, my 10" was not sounding less well as at 2E and I like a clean pop for my uppest Tom and E is in the arpeggio of C scale, not D, D is the 9th, you don't use a lot the 9th, well, you use it a lot but let's keep it simple, so, here I am with 2C, 2G, 2B and 2E, great!!! (If you have a 14, do 2F, you will have 4th between the C and the F and the F and the B and even a 4th between the B and the E, that's why they do 14" and 16", easier to have a better range than toms that are close...But you do with what you have right?)
Aso, I have 4 snares on my kit. Well, i had only one at first and it was doing a lot of sympathetic buzz. So, back again online and on this forum and one of the solution was to tune it, NOT at the same note as the TOM. so, my plain maple star reserve, the first sanre I bought was in G or G sharp, too close to the 13". in fact, check which Tom is making the snare buzzing the most and do the opposite, if you smack the snare, which Tom will resonate the most.
that was easy to solve as it's a 5", I like my snare to crack, so, A or even A sharp and way less buzz. Now that I have 4 snares, they are all in F sharp, G sharp or sharp something so, they don't buzz too much with the Toms. I do that for those who are on the lit but sometimes, the best sound I have is with not a sharp and I try it on the kit and sometimes, I,m good with it, i might have accepted the sympathetic buzz now as part of a drums kit.
If you leave in a place like me in canada when it's super dry in winter and super humid in summer, you will have another phase of heart attack because all will be messed up in one week with tuning falling down of 2 steps or up of 2 steps or even super low and dull!!!, so, I have now noted the conditions of dryness or humidity to recall what was the weather outside when I tuned it last time, see attachment.
Then, choose the resonance you want. it makes sense that, closer the pitch is for each side, better, bigger resonance you will have, in fact, if they are all in G, iT's like playing two strings of G on your guitar and of course, bigger sound or ditto for an octave, G3 and G4 will give you bigger resonance.
I choose the high resonance, not the Max:
Table 3. High Resonance with 4 Toms: 10″, 12″, 14″ and 16″. Bottom Head Higher.
And then, that's easy, they just tell you which one you need to go, so, tune with 2 keys, do this in the pattern attached and when you are close to the note you want, just put the tunebot close to the lug, read the hertz and press filter as people have said and one, it will tell you which one is off. I usually go by the 0,5 hertz and finalize with my ears because sometimes, they are better than the tunebot, if I'm not tired. The tunebot avoid the ears tiredness because you used it a lot at first to decided and have then fresh ears to fine tune.
SUPER GOOD TECHNIQUE I learn today in this post, keep you index under the tunebot to have the same high between the tunebot and the head. i was not doing this at first and the tuning was not the same, so, another issue that took me few minutes to understand why...Yes, in fact, the distance from the head and the distance of you stick to the rim will change the reading.
And then you save your tuning and you start to have a very well documented data sheet for you and a reference for the next time...And then, while it was taking me 3 hours to tune the whole kit, now, way less, one hour if it has moved a lot and i need to remove all the Toms, few minutes if it's just the batter head to fine tuned.
Well, that was long but you see that I want a long way to understand well what i was doing and my friend told me he doesn't know a lot of drummer who tune so accurately with specific notes in mind and he was a very good guy at tuning so, not bad for a keys player.
Pm me and I will give you my phone number if you want to talk about it, there is Snares now and Kick that are special beast for me...Or if people are not pissed of by such a long post, I cold do the same with sanres and kick as well.
Ok, pdf seemed to not be uploading so, i will give you the access of my data base on dropbox:
Last edited:
Quai34
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You have an 18 and a 24" as well, well, no examples on the website, I would do:
The calculator is giving you this:
18"
OCTAVE
1
NOTE
B
FUNDAMENTAL
62
BATTER PITCH
103
RESONANT PITCH
110
So, you see, note B1, 61 hertz for an 18", makes sense compared to my C2 at 64 to 66 hertz and I choose, resonance higher than batter, pitch adjustment, default and high resonance with batter pitch at 103 and resonant at 110. if you choose same for both head so, max resonance, which is what i like for my 16, you should be at 105/016?? yes, check it, i changed to max resonance and the calculator gives me 106 for both heads...
For your 24", I'm at...OUps, realized I have never notes in the tunebot or on my sheet what my Kick is at...give me two seconds..Ok, A1/55Hertz at the tunebot, cannot say the lugs pitch but they are all together by ears and the kick feels and sounds nicely. Maybe normal, A is the root of the relative minor scale of C scale, my tuning is CMAJ7 chord (C, G, B, E) so, maybe that's why I think they sound all good when I play them together one by one.
So, maybe, try G1? at 49 hertz??
on the link I gave you, there is documents on how to tune a bass drum as well, you have all the docs I gathered and read to learn how to tune. hey, the drummer at my store, hwo is around 40/45 and has been a drummer for 35 years is doing it faster than me but anytime i ask him because I,m lost, I still finalize it 1/2% better than him with the tune biot and my ears...Ok, he's not doing it with sales and notes like me.
Ha and yes, bit surprise for me: I learn very recently in looking at a video and now I understand how the guy at the store do it, because sometimes he was going so fast, i was not understanding anything, if you hear a lug that needs to be adjusted up, you adjust the opposite lug, not the same lug. So that you pull the head inside towards the middle instead of adding some tension more on the lug that is lower...Well, my friend was NOT doing that so, that's why it was taking me years with the tunebot to have all at the same tension. With two keys, it's even easier and if you have to detune (Most of the time, try to go up, very few to go down, when you finalize the evenness) on and tune up the opposite lug.
Also, attached is what I use to tune with one or two keys:
The calculator is giving you this:
18"
OCTAVE
1
NOTE
B
FUNDAMENTAL
62
BATTER PITCH
103
RESONANT PITCH
110
So, you see, note B1, 61 hertz for an 18", makes sense compared to my C2 at 64 to 66 hertz and I choose, resonance higher than batter, pitch adjustment, default and high resonance with batter pitch at 103 and resonant at 110. if you choose same for both head so, max resonance, which is what i like for my 16, you should be at 105/016?? yes, check it, i changed to max resonance and the calculator gives me 106 for both heads...
For your 24", I'm at...OUps, realized I have never notes in the tunebot or on my sheet what my Kick is at...give me two seconds..Ok, A1/55Hertz at the tunebot, cannot say the lugs pitch but they are all together by ears and the kick feels and sounds nicely. Maybe normal, A is the root of the relative minor scale of C scale, my tuning is CMAJ7 chord (C, G, B, E) so, maybe that's why I think they sound all good when I play them together one by one.
So, maybe, try G1? at 49 hertz??
on the link I gave you, there is documents on how to tune a bass drum as well, you have all the docs I gathered and read to learn how to tune. hey, the drummer at my store, hwo is around 40/45 and has been a drummer for 35 years is doing it faster than me but anytime i ask him because I,m lost, I still finalize it 1/2% better than him with the tune biot and my ears...Ok, he's not doing it with sales and notes like me.
Ha and yes, bit surprise for me: I learn very recently in looking at a video and now I understand how the guy at the store do it, because sometimes he was going so fast, i was not understanding anything, if you hear a lug that needs to be adjusted up, you adjust the opposite lug, not the same lug. So that you pull the head inside towards the middle instead of adding some tension more on the lug that is lower...Well, my friend was NOT doing that so, that's why it was taking me years with the tunebot to have all at the same tension. With two keys, it's even easier and if you have to detune (Most of the time, try to go up, very few to go down, when you finalize the evenness) on and tune up the opposite lug.
Also, attached is what I use to tune with one or two keys:
Rusty Knorr
Well-Known Member
Neither. Get the DrumTune Pro app. You’re welcome.
stevesmithfan
DFO Veteran
I agree.
What ere the pros and cons of the DrumTune app? And how does it compare to the TuneBot etc.?
Malc
Well-Known Member
I use the Drumtune Pro app primarily due to it being far cheaper than a tunebot and that as it's on my phone, it's always with me.
Well, thank you for putting all of that effort into your reply and being so helpful! I am able to tune drums by ear, but it takes me hours and I am never sure if I am truly in the zone or it just sounds good enough. My set is in a recording studio so I got the Tune-Bot to (1) do this quicker, (2) be able to recall a tuning quick and consistently, and (3) help me get in the zone.
One problem I have is that I simply don't know what the zone is on an early 80s Ludwig with 24" kick, 13" & 18" toms and need need some pointers on what to try. With drums not being my primary instrument, I don't have the ear for getting there on my own. I do have the ear for dialing it in once I'm close.
The other problem is that I am having a hard time with operating the Tune-bot properly since (as everyone cautioned) the instructions are terrible!
