Is it possible to remove a re-ring from a shell?

egw

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I'm thinking of cutting down a BD I built, but it's a Keller shell with Keller rings glued in. I know the best thing would be to start over with a new re-ring and glue it into the cut down shell, but I'm in Japan and shipping on a single 22" ring would be prohibitively expensive.

So the only realistic thing to do would be to use that old ring. But it's been glued and clamped. Is there any possibility of removing it even remotely cleanly? And if so, how?
 

amosguy

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Betting there are more than one video on Youtube.

It can be done, but some glue jobs are better than others.
 
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K.O.

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I removed a ring recently on an old Ludwig by putting it in the microwave to heat it up. Not sure that would work with more modern glues. The other issue was there were a few sparkles left in the scarf joint from the old wrap and they started to spark. Once I managed to scrape them out things went smoothly but the piece of 14" shell just barely fit into our microwave and the shell itself was totally destroyed in the process (just the upper part of a cut off shell so no matter). The microwave heated the glue and softened it enough that I could pull chunks of the shell off the ring until only the ring remained. Then I reinstalled the hoop into the lower section of the former marching snare.

resulting in this drum...

mo 6.5.jpg
 
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thin shell

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The ring is plywood just like the rest of the shell so it is several plys of wood glued together. The ring is then glued into the shell, probably with a PVA glue (yellow carpenters glue) which creates a very strong bond. Steam is the best thing to get a ring lose but I have only done it on rings that were a solid piece of maple so I don't know if you could steam a plywood ring out without separating all of the plies of the ring. Older shells which were put together with hide glue are much easier to steam apart. That is why it is still used for making violins since the top has to be removed to be able to do repairs and PVA glue would make it very difficult to get apart without damaging the top.
 
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davezedlee

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if you know someone who makes drums, see if he can route it out using an inside turning jig
inside.jpg
 
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egw

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Thanks for the input everybody. So yeah, it sounds like my first inclination was the same as what everyone else is thinking here. The rings on this drum were done by me and I know that they're firmly in there. So at this point I likely wouldn't have any more luck separating the ring from the shell than I would dissecting any of the other plies.

Oh, well. I guess it's on to plan B. Thanks again.
 

K.O.

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The ring is plywood just like the rest of the shell so it is several plys of wood glued together.
The ring I removed was solid maple (old Ludwig) so yet another reason my desperation method wouldn't work for the OP.
 

Barden

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Thanks for the input everybody. So yeah, it sounds like my first inclination was the same as what everyone else is thinking here. The rings on this drum were done by me and I know that they're firmly in there. So at this point I likely wouldn't have any more luck separating the ring from the shell than I would dissecting any of the other plies.

Oh, well. I guess it's on to plan B. Thanks again.
how much shell are you cutting off and does it have a finish on it?

If your ring is 1" deep and you're cutting off more than 2" (for example), use the next inch of shell to make your new ring. You'll just have to remove the difference in circumference while scarfing the joint back together. Obviously this has its challenges, but it could be done.
 
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K.O.

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Could you procure a cheap old drum locally to get a ring out of? Those old MIJ drums all had re-rings in them. Probably wouldn't be that hard to get one out either. Worst case you'd have to chisel the lauan shell away from the ring. That might be something you could find for cheap right where you're at.
 
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ThomasL

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If your ring is 1" deep and you're cutting off more than 2" (for example), use the next inch of shell to make your new ring. You'll just have to remove the difference in circumference while scarfing the joint back together. Obviously this has its challenges, but it could be done.
Or, would it be possible to cut away the shell from the outside with a router, leaving only the re-ring? (Note, I said possible, not easy...)
 
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Barden

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Or, would it be possible to cut away the shell from the outside with a router, leaving only the re-ring? (Note, I said possible, not easy...)
I was thinking about that. You would need to use an epoxy as the adhesive when applied because wood glue won't want to stick to its dried self.
 
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thin shell

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Could you procure a cheap old drum locally to get a ring out of? Those old MIJ drums all had re-rings in them. Probably wouldn't be that hard to get one out either. Worst case you'd have to chisel the lauan shell away from the ring. That might be something you could find for cheap right where you're at.
Those rings on MIJ drums were made out of pine so I would pass.
 
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egw

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how much shell are you cutting off and does it have a finish on it?

If your ring is 1" deep and you're cutting off more than 2" (for example), use the next inch of shell to make your new ring. You'll just have to remove the difference in circumference while scarfing the joint back together. Obviously this has its challenges, but it could be done.
Thanks again for thinking about this, guys. To answer your question, the drum is a 6-ply Keller maple shell, wrapped in red glass glitter, with 10-ply Keller re-rings (yes, 10-ply). It's currently an 18x22", and the idea was to strip it down to the bare shell, cut it down to 14x22", and refinish it with tung oil.

This is a drum that I built about 15 years ago, which is just not being used. And to be completely honest, this whole idea really arose out of boredom more than anything else.

But I've decided not to go ahead with the original plan, and am now in the process of just refinishing the hoops. They were originally wrapped in the same glass glitter wrap as the shell, both outside AND inside. But the sharp edge of the glitter wrap got a bunch of chips in it over the years, which is the thing that really was bothering me about this drum. It was a poor choice to begin with. But when I built this drum, I was really impressed by lacquer sparkle finishes (Yamaha, etc.) where the bass drum hoops have the sparkle finish on the entire surface, and I was attempting to copy that. In retrospect, it was an admittedly stupid idea. Not only did it leave it open to damage, the wrap on the inside of the hoops messed up the alignment with the heads. Anyway, I've already stripped the hoops and rounded the outer edges. At some point this week, I plan to get on to the oil finish.

The drum in question was also central to this other recent thread. You can see a photo here if you're interested.

 

Tommy D

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So you wrapped the inside of the hoops as well? That's interesting. Do you have any photos of the kit set up? I have questioned what it would look like to do an inlay on the inside of a bass drum hoop, but then I realized you would have 2 visable seams and I decided against trying it.
 

egw

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So you wrapped the inside of the hoops as well? That's interesting. Do you have any photos of the kit set up? I have questioned what it would look like to do an inlay on the inside of a bass drum hoop, but then I realized you would have 2 visable seams and I decided against trying it.
I searched and the only photos of the kit I could find were these. At the time, all I had was a 1.0 megapixel digital camera, so the glitter wrap didn't read very well, but you can get the idea.

Concerning the wrap seam(s) on the hoops, the short section on the outside was at the bottom, and on the inside it was at the top, in order to minimize visibility. You wouldn't notice it from any more than a few feet away.

The floor tom from this set is now my nesting bass drum, and the 22" kick is the one I in the OP here. The 12" tom I sold on ebay probably 12 years ago now.
Screenshot_20200409-001453.png
Screenshot_20200409-001453.png
Screenshot_20200409-001437.png
 
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