Late 80s(?) DW kit, information please!

musiqman

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This was mine

1614414492500.png

The kit had a 2nd gen badge 8” tom too. This was an exact match.

1614414715582.png


You can see the Tama brackets on this one real good here.

I remember that someone I know had a kit from 1993 (newly bought) with the 1st gen badges.

Strangly Pink Floyd used a 2nd gen badge kit on the 1993 recordings of the Divison Bell.

So there seems to be an overlap period in 1993.
 

Treviso1

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I had late 80s and early 90s DW kits and they were all 6ply/6ply (6/6) reinforcement hoop shells. The OP's 5/3 & 6/3 shells didn't come into production until 1993. I really preferred the original 6/6 shells as they were closer in sound to Camco Drums. I actually picked my kit up from the old DW factory in Oxnard, CA in the summer of 1990. It was at that time that I was told by Mike Murphy that Danny Seraphine was fired from Chicago.
 

John DeChristopher

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I had late 80s and early 90s DW kits and they were all 6ply/6ply (6/6) reinforcement hoop shells. The OP's 5/3 & 6/3 shells didn't come into production until 1993. I really preferred the original 6/6 shells as they were closer in sound to Camco Drums. I actually picked my kit up from the old DW factory in Oxnard, CA in the summer of 1990. It was at that time that I was told by Mike Murphy that Danny Seraphine was fired from Chicago.
That might explain why there's a 13" tom in his kit. Being that it was after things got going for them and I believe there was a demand for 13" toms. Maybe?

They were still in Newbury Park (Thousand Oaks area) in 1990. I visited them at least once in 1990 or 1991, and then again when I drove Joey Kramer to the factory in February of 1992 when Aerosmith was in Los Angeles recording what would be "Get A Grip." I think the move to Oxnard was later in the 1990s. But you're 100% correct about Danny being dismissed from Chicago in the summer of 1990. I'll never forget getting that call...
 

John DeChristopher

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Thank you John for all that incredible info! Do you remember, anecdotally even, what the production environment was like in 86-89 for DW drum kits? Were they mostly custom orders, or were there sets being shipped out to pre-existing dealers, etc?

Very interesting bit about the 13 rarity. I wonder why the dislike?
My pleasure. I enjoyed recalling the memories. Production in those early years was small. A lot of kits were custom orders for local/LA drummers. Building a dealer network was slow initially. We had a few dealers, but nothing like what DW is now. The drums were a hard sell initially because of their cost, we didn't have a strong artist roster (yet) and even though DW was the brand leader in pedals and hardware, the drums were an unknown quantity. Many dealers were hesitant to take on the line at first. Hard to believe that now! It was even more difficult getting the drums into other countries, due to limited distribution and of course, the cost. Jason Bonham was an early endorser and that helped, as did Danny Seraphine, Larrie Londin, Rikki Rockett and a few other early endorsers. We were definitely getting traction by the time I left in May 1989...

John Good was "practically" a one-man band. We hired Pat Foley in 1987 to do our finishes. Pat had done custom finishes for many pro drummers, so getting him was a plus. At some point he moved on and we hired a guy who was building drums out of his garage in Woodland Hills. That guy was Bill Detamore. This was still probably 1987. I was living in the next town, Canoga Park, so Bill and I used to carpool from the San Fernando Valley to Newbury Park. So great to see what Bill has built with Pork Pie Percussion.

As for John's dislike of 13" toms, I think he felt the interval between a 12" and a 13" was too close and didn't work. And I think he felt even on its own, a 13" doesn't have a wide enough tuning range, or something to that effect. Maybe someone can ask him - it's been a long time since we discussed 13" toms. I personally love 13" toms! lol

I've done a bunch of interviews and have talked about my time at DW during those early years. I don't want to hijack this thread...
 

musiqman

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I had late 80s and early 90s DW kits and they were all 6ply/6ply (6/6) reinforcement hoop shells. The OP's 5/3 & 6/3 shells didn't come into production until 1993. I really preferred the original 6/6 shells as they were closer in sound to Camco Drums. I actually picked my kit up from the old DW factory in Oxnard, CA in the summer of 1990. It was at that time that I was told by Mike Murphy that Danny Seraphine was fired from Chicago.
But the badges on his kit are definitely pre-1993. So maybe they were experimenting already with those shells.

This is what Keller said to me when I wanted extra shells (which they couldn't;t do anymore)

DW’s smaller diameter were 5/3 construction. 16”, 18” and 22” and larger were 6/2. The outlier was the 20” bass drums. They used the 5/3 construction for these.
 

n2600

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This is a badge from a set I have. Sequential serial numbers with pencil date in the bass interior, ‘91

Phil
Thank you Phil for this information!!

1xxxxx ('81? Prior to '81?)
2xxxxx ('82? '82 to ??)
3xxxxx (??)
Axxxxx 1991 A021XX (drumphils, pencil date inside bass drum)
Bxxxxx (??)
 

musiqman

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Also, the earlier models only had natural and walnut finishes, later in the 80's they added lacquer finishes

And the 80's models had T rods on the BD's.
 

musiqman

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Like this one:

Interestingly it has a 6 digit code where as mine has a 4 digit code.
 

n2600

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Interestingly it has a 6 digit code where as mine has a 4 digit code.
Hey Musiqman!

If you’re talking about the badge you posted earlier A038XX, I believe the first character in their serial numbers may have designated a year, or a period, 1, 2, 3, A, and B, before moving to the “HANDCRAFTED SINCE 1972” badges, so they all had five digits in their serials.
Your point is well taken — the earlier the DW, the more Camco hardware is present, including the Trods. The earliest have the Camco spurs. My kit (A00XXX) only has Camco claws.

Update:

1xxxxx serials:
1981 (User 4164SB writes “Both snares have have 100 prefix serial numbers and were purchased new in 1981.)

2xxxxx serials:
1982 (User 4164SB writes “The set has 200 prefix and was ordered and received in 1982.)
1982 (User antipodes writes he sold a snare serial 200505, stamped Oct 7 1982”)

3xxxxx serials
(??)

Axxxxx serials
1991 A021XX (User drumphils, pencil date inside bass drum)

Bxxxxx serials
(??)


This is the thread (which also has some nice DW / Camco observations) is here: https://www.drumforum.org/threads/dating-early-dws.52628/
 

musiqman

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Hey Musiqman!

If you’re talking about the badge you posted earlier A038XX, I believe the first character in their serial numbers may have designated a year, or a period, 1, 2, 3, A, and B, before moving to the “HANDCRAFTED SINCE 1972” badges, so they all had five digits in their serials.
Your point is well taken — the earlier the DW, the more Camco hardware is present, including the Trods. The earliest have the Camco spurs. My kit (A00XXX) only has Camco claws.

Update:

1xxxxx serials:
1981 (User 4164SB writes “Both snares have have 100 prefix serial numbers and were purchased new in 1981.)

2xxxxx serials:
1982 (User 4164SB writes “The set has 200 prefix and was ordered and received in 1982.)
1982 (User antipodes writes he sold a snare serial 200505, stamped Oct 7 1982”)

3xxxxx serials
(??)

Axxxxx serials
1991 A021XX (User drumphils, pencil date inside bass drum)

Bxxxxx serials
(??)


This is the thread (which also has some nice DW / Camco observations) is here: https://www.drumforum.org/threads/dating-early-dws.52628/
I mean, mine has less numbers.

But it came without t rods, but the bass drum from ebay is older but has a high serialnumber.

Also later on the 2nd gen badges, DW used B for Birch and A for maple.
 

musiqman

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Looks like the twin to mine. Sounds like you let it go. Which sizes had it?
Yes. I ended up with a full custom DW that works much better for me.

It was a 8 (2nd gen model)/10/12/14/16/22 model.
1614459961340.jpeg

1614459979364.jpeg


It had a matching 80’s 14x6,5 black brass snare:
1614460012996.jpeg


I upgraded this one with a mag strainer and 3p (yea I had to drill two new holes, worth every drop of sweat though :-D)

Later on I purchased a 70’s 15x6,5 Gon Bops Timbale Shell brass snare with camco hardware:
1614460058687.jpeg
 
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Elvis

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We can agree to disagree on that point, and I'm confused why you're now saying this after your piano analogy which I think is great. A piano, you'll agree I hope, is pretty much all notes and chords.

Tuning drums is a subjective thing, "what's best for the drum" and "what's best for the song."
I also said tuning to a note is not a bad thing, but again, the 13 is like tuning a half step, thus my piano analogy.
The black keys are not full step increments. They are the notes between the adjacent white keys.
If you're thinking in terms of a full step, then you'll tend to tune to notes that fall within that range.
The 13, not quite being there by design, will then give you fits.
This is why I say just tune the drum to a "good sound", rather than aiming for notes.
Of course, maybe this dialogue has got you thinking in another direction now, so maybe tuning future 13" drums might not be quite such an issue?

Elvis
 
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n2600

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Gorgeous kit and snares! I love that black brass snare!

Update:

1xxxxx serials:
1981 (User 4164SB writes “Both snares have have 100 prefix serial numbers and were purchased new in 1981.)
1981 (User orangemi on vintagedrumforum.com writes he acquired a snare from its original owner who purchased it new in 81. The snare carried the 100 prefix.)

2xxxxx serials:
1982 (User 4164SB writes “The set has 200 prefix and was ordered and received in 1982.)
1982 (User antipodes writes he sold a snare serial 200505, stamped Oct 7 1982”)
1982 (User orangemi on vintagedrumforum.com writes he acquired a set whose original owner ordered it from DW summer 82 and received it fall 82. All serials started with 200 prefix.)

3xxxxx serials
(??)

Axxxxx serials
1991 A021XX (User drumphils, pencil date inside bass drum)

Bxxxxx serials
(??)

Relevant threads:
https://www.drumforum.org/threads/dating-early-dws.52628/
 

Tarkus

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To keep this going....

Now, I got a respond from the shop owner that I mentioned. He kept this drum kit (8/10/12/13/16/22) all the years. Serial number of one tom is 'B2399'. And it is definitely a maple kit, DW did not even offer birch shells these days. This answers at least the issue 'B=birch', which is simply not true.

Btw, this was the showcase drum kit during first appearance of DW at 'Musikmesse Frankfurt', a large German music fair. At DW, they must have kept a special eye during production. It was an important opener for European market.
Sorry, that I can't post images. It's 'Royal blue', and looks fantastic.
 

musiqman

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To keep this going....

Now, I got a respond from the shop owner that I mentioned. He kept this drum kit (8/10/12/13/16/22) all the years. Serial number of one tom is 'B2399'. And it is definitely a maple kit, DW did not even offer birch shells these days. This answers at least the issue 'B=birch', which is simply not true.

Btw, this was the showcase drum kit during first appearance of DW at 'Musikmesse Frankfurt', a large German music fair. At DW, they must have kept a special eye during production. It was an important opener for European market.
Sorry, that I can't post images. It's 'Royal blue', and looks fantastic.
Actually B is DW’s denotation for Birch since the 2nd gen.

Maybe not the first gen, but for sure the later years.
 

n2600

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To keep this going....

Now, I got a respond from the shop owner that I mentioned. He kept this drum kit (8/10/12/13/16/22) all the years. Serial number of one tom is 'B2399'. And it is definitely a maple kit, DW did not even offer birch shells these days. This answers at least the issue 'B=birch', which is simply not true.

Btw, this was the showcase drum kit during first appearance of DW at 'Musikmesse Frankfurt', a large German music fair. At DW, they must have kept a special eye during production. It was an important opener for European market.
Sorry, that I can't post images. It's 'Royal blue', and looks fantastic.
Thank you for this information! Is it possible to ascertain the year he purchased this kit?

I'd also love to hear from people who might have shells / drums with year for the 300xxx prefix!

Cheers!
 

Elvis

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Actually B is DW’s denotation for Birch since the 2nd gen.

Maybe not the first gen, but for sure the later years.
Never heard of a Birch shelled DW....are you referring to Pacific drums?
 


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