Paiste 2002 or Paiste Formula 602 Modern Essentials or....?

Medellin

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Hi guys!

I just joined the forum and would appreciate some wisdom and advice i regards to choosing new cymbals!

I am looking to purchase a whole new set of cymbals to use for recording and gigs.

The style of music I play is hard rock and blues.

Yes, the easy choice here would be to just get the Paiste 2002s but I am COMPLETELY open to other options and would love to get some suggestions.

I have read some good things about the 602 ME cymbals but heard that they my not project well enough for this kind of music when distorted guitars are involved.

Thanks in advance!
 

CaptainCrunch

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Could you describe your band with a few RIYL similar examples?

2002's are absolutely the gold standard, but I personally like a darker sound. But from 602 ME's to 602's to 2002's to 2002 Big Beats to Giant Beats, that's a pretty deep well of choices without even leaving one wall of the cymbal room.

And "hard rock" is pretty broad. If you mean "1973 Led Zeppelin" that's a huge gulf from if you mean "1993 Pantera".
 

Medellin

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Could you describe your band with a few RIYL similar examples?

2002's are absolutely the gold standard, but I personally like a darker sound. But from 602 ME's to 602's to 2002's to 2002 Big Beats to Giant Beats, that's a pretty deep well of choices without even leaving one wall of the cymbal room.

And "hard rock" is pretty broad. If you mean "1973 Led Zeppelin" that's a huge gulf from if you mean "1993 Pantera".
You're right.

We are the fringe between Black Sabbath (Paranoid-ish style), Led Zeppelin (The girl I love has black wavy hair) and Deep Purple (Into the fire).

Have you or anyone else had experienced the 602 MEs in a live setting? Especially the crashes.

I like that sound because its along the same vein but not exactly a copy. Worried about projection and volume compared to something like a 2002 when it comes to a live setting.
 

jtpaistegeist

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I would go for the 602 ME's. I use these for everything from jazz to death metal and they work wonderfully.
 

A Stick

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I agree with the above statement. 602 ME's are Paiste's best line of cymbals. I use them for playing alternative rock to reggae.
 

nickrobotron

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I play 15" ME hats, 22" ME ride, 20" ME crash, and a 18" 602 classics thin crash. They are great and cutting on stage and certainly do the job well. They are also much more versatile than the B8/2002 alloy. It was my personal best investment in cymbals. But if you are going to stick to those genres, I'm going to go ahead and recommend 2002's. Here's why:

-You have a lot of options with crashes when you throw Giant Beats and Big Beats into the mix. Also, don't overlook the Innovations line. That strange lathing makes for a beautiful fast crash. There's an 18" Thin for sale on eBay or Reverb (can't remember) right now.

-If you don't know what you want, you can try out the used market more easily. They're cheaper and much more readily available.

-Depending on how heavy your rock band is, you have a plethora of heavy rides in the 2002 line. That B8 alloy really sits high in the stage mix.

If I had a good budget for 2002's, my dream set up would be: 22" Ride (or heavy ride, depending on what music I was making), 15" Sound Edge hi hats, 19" and 20" Crash (Thins have a tendency to get wavy edges). I'd grab a 24" Giant Beat on the side for when I need a big, deep, low washy ride.
 
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jaymandude

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Yeah... Start with the 2002's and work your way into the other lines, rather than the other way around..
 

CaptainCrunch

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I don't own any ME's, but the ones I've played in-store have seemed REALLY nice, and I get people who say they're like the Sound Creation "Normal" models that never existed. Eye-wateringly expensive, but when it comes to spending money my pain threshold is comically low.

Thing is, it's not like you're locked in to only one line - if you dig the ME 24", a Big Beat 20", Giant Beat 18", regular 602 16", Signature 8" splash, Sound Creation flat, and some old 3000 RUDE hats, they'll all work together. That's Paiste's true genius - some kind of shared wavelength they're all tuned to.

I have and like the GB Bonham set, and it could keep up with a combo-amp-loud rock band unmic'd. Half-stacks and up, I'd want heavier weaponry.
 

doubleroll

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ME are wonderful, makes me think of the last show I attended...Vinnie with Jeff Beck. However, in this case I would go 2002s. They are a great fit for the type of music you described. I recently went that route as well for a classic rock band. While I have Paiste Dark Energy and Zildjian K Custom for darker or just different sound.
I needed up with the following 2002:
22” Ride
18” Crash
19” Thin Crash
20” Crash
15” SE Hats

Also rotate in as needed:
20” China
 

Medellin

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All great points!

I think at this point I am really between two set ups.

15 602 ME Hi Hats
18 602 ME crash
20 602 ME crash
24 602 ME ride

Or

15 2002 SE hats
18 2002 crash
20 2002 crash
24 2002 big ride (giant beat that has 2002 finish)

I’ve done hours of research and listened to tons of recordings of every possible traditional style combo: Zildjian, Paiste, meinl, Sabian, instanbul Agop and mehmet, etc.

They are all amazing but right now I am at a crossroads between 2002 and ME. I would go giant beat but only if they made the crashes slightly heavier. Maybe in the future

The only thing holding me back from 602 ME is the crashes. I’ve heard mixed stories about them. Can’t seem to find one at a local shop.
 

mgdrummer

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About 4 years ago I joined a classic rock cover band and I purchased a whole set of 2002’s in essentially the same sizes you’re considering. They were great in festival & large club/theater settings but I felt the 24” ride and large crashes became overwhelming in small/mid sized rooms, even when I was trying my best to back off & not to play them too hard. They sound amazing but for my needs they were too much of a good thing. I’m currently back to using my reissued 602’s (15” SE hats, 18/20 thin crashes and 22” medium ride) since I already have them, but I would like to build up another 2002 set but this time get the thin crashes and a smaller ride.
 

nickrobotron

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All great points!

I think at this point I am really between two set ups.

15 602 ME Hi Hats
18 602 ME crash
20 602 ME crash
24 602 ME ride

Or

15 2002 SE hats
18 2002 crash
20 2002 crash
24 2002 big ride (giant beat that has 2002 finish)

I’ve done hours of research and listened to tons of recordings of every possible traditional style combo: Zildjian, Paiste, meinl, Sabian, instanbul Agop and mehmet, etc.

They are all amazing but right now I am at a crossroads between 2002 and ME. I would go giant beat but only if they made the crashes slightly heavier. Maybe in the future

The only thing holding me back from 602 ME is the crashes. I’ve heard mixed stories about them. Can’t seem to find one at a local shop.
Do what I did! Snag an 18" or 19" Thin Crash in stead of the Modern Essentials! The 20" ME is great though, because it's like a perfect crash/ride (mostly crash), which is a necessary pair when you have that big 24" ME ride.
 

Medellin

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About 4 years ago I joined a classic rock cover band and I purchased a whole set of 2002’s in essentially the same sizes you’re considering. They were great in festival & large club/theater settings but I felt the 24” ride and large crashes became overwhelming in small/mid sized rooms, even when I was trying my best to back off & not to play them too hard. They sound amazing but for my needs they were too much of a good thing. I’m currently back to using my reissued 602’s (15” SE hats, 18/20 thin crashes and 22” medium ride) since I already have them, but I would like to build up another 2002 set but this time get the thin crashes and a smaller ride.
So that is a great point!

The rooms that we are playing in are small to medium-sized.
 

Jdrum

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Black Sabbath, Zeppelin, Deep Purple? Big 2002s.
X2!

Most of the reasons have been mentioned already as far as my opinion. I had a full set of modern essentials in those exact sizes except for the 24. Great cymbals and miss them occasionally but I would pick my 2002’s in a “Heartbeat” (pun intended) for the music you mentioned despite the versatility of the ME’s. As mentioned, you could always throw in a Big Beat or Giant Beat for lighter stuff. 22” Big Beat is super versatile. Great crash and works as a nice ride except when you want lots of definition.
 

Bonzo442

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For hard rock I would go 2oo2 set up in fact they sell cymbal sets includes 22” ride which is a very versatile ride along with a 20 & 18” crash along with 14” sound edge hats. They also sell a Bonham set up with 15” se hats along with a 24” ride. Playing small venues where being to loud is an issue you can buy the giant beat set instead. That set up would be slightly quieter and includes a 24” multi along with a 20”&18” multi and 15” hats. When buying the set you get discount.
 


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