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Seeking Flat or Smaller Bell Ride Suggestion, but Not for Jazz

JDA

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Search in the back of the used-car lots.
"lowest price first" search on ebay for cymbals.

wager you'll find a " 70s Ufip 18" Made in Italy" for $72 that will be just perfect
..parked sideways at the back of the lot
....
 
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Acidwash

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What about those dream flat earth rides? Recently ordered one based on videos on the net. Sounded pretty great as a ride and crashed in a really cool way. Will report when the one I ordered arrives.
 

JDA

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Ever the optimist, I’m looking ahead to that new, golden, shining era where I rehearse with my cover and original bands again. These practices are often close and lower volume. The last thing one needs in a garage built for a Model T is a cymbal that washes out vocal and guitar chords. I’ve been getting by fine with some of my lighter As and Ks, but they take a lot of restraint.

I’ve been trying to decide if I want a flat ride or mini cup ride, and am looking for pros and cons of each. Sabian or Zildjian are the brands I prefer. This is not for jazz; it’d need to be an all-rounder low volume for rehearsals covering rock to country to singer-songwriter acoustic—all in one evening. I would not gig with it, just use it to keep time in a setting where we are roughing out songs and I don’t want to get in the way.

I’m not taking a crash to these rehearsals, just a bikini kit with a ride.

One flat I’ve played often, not mine, was a 20” K Custom Dark. I liked it a lot, but of course it seemed one dimensional, and I could not crash it well, and when one just has one cymbal I missed the bell. The only small bell ride—of sorts—I’ve played is my 20” K Con Medium which is just too moody and dark for these styles of music, although it’s a wonderful left side piece. An old A flat could work well in the volume aspect, and I’m curious what gram weight some of you might recommend. Small bells I’m considering are the old Zildjian Mini Cups and the Sabian Mini Bell or Carl Allen. I've never played any of these, so this is new territory. If they are a lot louder than flats then maybe that's my answer.

Basically these are older models, so I’d be buying used and probably not able to hear them in person, which is why I’m reaching out here. Given the state of things with in person live music, I guess I can take my time.

May your your beat be deep, your lottery tickets be winners, and your tinnitus fly away.
 

Pibroch

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18" Bosphorus Master Vintage flat - mine has virtually no character and you can crash the hell out of it quietly! Has an extremely even and polite wash - the opposite of a gongy flat and you can't get an unpleasant overtone or ring no matter what sticks you use.
 

CC Cirillo

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Everyone: I appreciate all the thoughtful and tested suggestions here.

Multijd, thanks for the Zildjian Uptown and Sabian Garage suggestions as I was unaware of either of these 18” rides. Of these two workable options, the Uptown was quite a bit less than the Garage, so I focused on the Zildjian.
(And thank you Chappy and Soulfinger for answering my specific questions about your experiences.)

I ended up getting an Uptown at about 1660 grams and about $140 less than the Sabian . This type of creature is new for me, and I hope will fill the lower volume niche. So far I’ve only been able to play it in isolation, literally, alone, on my practice pad kit, not a drum in sight. The volume is certainly within the realm I’m looking—or listening—for. Obviously only after using it within a band will we be properly introduced. At that point, maybe sometime in 2021, I’ll give an Uptown Update.

This is my first true “dry” ride, my first unlathed and unbathed piece. For me a commonsense and affordable jumping off point into a whole new category of cymbal. It sure is homely, a broken piece of a lopsided metal golf ball hit upward by a titan, unevenly charred on its re-entry into the atmosphere. The sound, being so different than anything else I own, is intriguing.

(PS: Being that this Uptown was less than I expected to pay, and being that I’m now getting about two weeks to the gallon on gas working remotely during lockdown, saving a bit on commute costs, I bid on a K flat ride auction and won. About 2100 grams. Probably arrives next week, so my original intent to experiment with a small bell ride or a flat ride is coming to fruition on bo, albeit through the dangerous route of buying before hearing.)
7D65CDB0-36A0-4167-B492-664B66DD6DC7.jpeg
 

dogue

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What about those dream flat earth rides? Recently ordered one based on videos on the net. Sounded pretty great as a ride and crashed in a really cool way. Will report when the one I ordered arrives.
@Acidwash Resurrecting an old thread; what were your impressions of the Flat Earth?
 

Elvis

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@Acidwash Resurrecting an old thread; what were your impressions of the Flat Earth?
Concerning the Flat Earth Ride, it should be noted that it is based on the 24" Bliss Small Bell Ride, and since that one hasn't been mentioned yet...


...and for comparative purposes, here's the 22" Dream Dark Matter Flat Earth Ride...

 

dboomer

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If what you are asking for is a loud flat ride, I have a Sabian Radia (Bozzio) flat that is far louder than any of my other half dozen flatrides. It’s very thick and heavy about 3400g (20”)
 

zenstat

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there was no choice 2650 for a 20 is average (have one) lot of cymbal
like Controlled Ping rides.
A Custom Flat 20 is a softer lower pitch, have one 2000g

Just a quick follow up for future readers. This was Joe overgeneralizing from a couple of cymbals he owns. Yes the average for 20" Flat Top Rides is about 2650g, but this leaves out any information on how variable they are. Of course, you can't know that if your sample is based on one. :)

They came in a variety of weights from 1875g which has an Ex. Thin weight class stamp

20-1875-ink.jpg


to HEAVY weight class at a portly 3094g

20-3094-top.jpg


and weight classes in between. The flat ride (official name Flat Top Ride) came out in 1976, and the early ones have a 60s stamp on them. The more we look at individual models the more we begin to understand the longevity of what we nickname the 60s stamp, and how much variation there was. I maintain that learning about these issues gives us more choice.

20-3094-stamp.jpg
 

BlackPearl

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Just a quick follow up for future readers. This was Joe overgeneralizing from a couple of cymbals he owns. Yes the average for 20" Flat Top Rides is about 2650g, but this leaves out any information on how variable they are. Of course, you can't know that if your sample is based on one. :)

They came in a variety of weights from 1875g which has an Ex. Thin weight class stamp

View attachment 595722

to HEAVY weight class at a portly 3094g

View attachment 595723

and weight classes in between. The flat ride (official name Flat Top Ride) came out in 1976, and the early ones have a 60s stamp on them. The more we look at individual models the more we begin to understand the longevity of what we nickname the 60s stamp, and how much variation there was. I maintain that learning about these issues gives us more choice.

View attachment 595724
Not sure if you're in need of more data points, but I have an A Custom 20" Flat Top ride in brilliant finish that weighs in at 2088 g on my kitchen scale. It's a great cymbal.
 

CAMDRUMS

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Concerning the Flat Earth Ride, it should be noted that it is based on the 24" Bliss Small Bell Ride, and since that one hasn't been mentioned yet...


...and for comparative purposes, here's the 22" Dream Dark Matter Flat Earth Ride...

I was able to snag a 20” Bliss small bell flat ride. Very quiet cymbal, a bit more controlled than the 24”
 

dogue

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I was able to snag a 20” Bliss small bell flat ride. Very quiet cymbal, a bit more controlled than the 24”
Seems like it was only a prototype; is that right? I’d be curious to hear it.
 

DavedrumsTX

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Ever the optimist, I’m looking ahead to that new, golden, shining era where I rehearse with my cover and original bands again. These practices are often close and lower volume. The last thing one needs in a garage built for a Model T is a cymbal that washes out vocal and guitar chords. I’ve been getting by fine with some of my lighter As and Ks, but they take a lot of restraint.

I’ve been trying to decide if I want a flat ride or mini cup ride, and am looking for pros and cons of each. Sabian or Zildjian are the brands I prefer. This is not for jazz; it’d need to be an all-rounder low volume for rehearsals covering rock to country to singer-songwriter acoustic—all in one evening. I would not gig with it, just use it to keep time in a setting where we are roughing out songs and I don’t want to get in the way.

I’m not taking a crash to these rehearsals, just a bikini kit with a ride.

One flat I’ve played often, not mine, was a 20” K Custom Dark. I liked it a lot, but of course it seemed one dimensional, and I could not crash it well, and when one just has one cymbal I missed the bell. The only small bell ride—of sorts—I’ve played is my 20” K Con Medium which is just too moody and dark for these styles of music, although it’s a wonderful left side piece. An old A flat could work well in the volume aspect, and I’m curious what gram weight some of you might recommend. Small bells I’m considering are the old Zildjian Mini Cups and the Sabian Mini Bell or Carl Allen. I've never played any of these, so this is new territory. If they are a lot louder than flats then maybe that's my answer.

Basically these are older models, so I’d be buying used and probably not able to hear them in person, which is why I’m reaching out here. Given the state of things with in person live music, I guess I can take my time.

May your your beat be deep, your lottery tickets be winners, and your tinnitus fly away.
I love flat rides. My favorites:
18” Sabian HH Flat Ride
20” Paiste Signature Flat Ride

The new Paiste Master’s Flat Rides are crazy beautiful too.

 
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