Update- reply from Istanbul Agop rep - Agop Signature Hats

[swayed1]

I purchased a set of 15” Agop sigs from a forum member last week. They look incredible and arrived in great condition. Here we go! I go to seat the bottom hat on to my DW5000 stand and it doesn’t fit... The top hat fits just fine but it appears that the hole in the bottom hat is significantly smaller.

I have a second hh stand - a DW7000 - and it just fits on the sleeve but still won’t go all the way down. I messaged the seller and he states he used a DW 9000 and never had an issue. I made a video to try and explain the issue better. See below. Feel free to chime in. Has anyone else ever seen issues like this w Agops? Seller said he would look into it and suggested I post a thread here. I suppose I could by another hh stand or have the hole drilled to the correct size... This was my first Agop purchase - it’s not going so well. Seller states they were purchased new from Maxwells in NY within the last year.

 

[hsosdrum]

Don't re-drill the cymbal hole. Instead, see if you can shave-down the post on the hi-hat stand's bottom cymbal seat so it's thin enough to accept the new cymbal.

 

[swayed1]

Has anyone else has ever noticed a discrepancy in hole sizes on their Agop hats? Can you take a look?

These are supposed to be pro level cymbals and they were not cheap. Am I making a big deal out of nothing here?

I don’t want to modify the cymbal. Nor do I don’t want to shave down the post. I also don’t want to buy a DW9000 or any other stand. I wanted (and surely expected) the holes to be the correct size.

Here are some additional thoughts after sleeping on it:

If I shave down the post what will that do to the action for my other hi hats that already have the correct hole size?

I won’t ever be able to bring these hats to a venue or a studio with a house kit for fear that they won’t fit.

I can also never knowingly resell what I suspect should have been at the minimum a “B” stock item to begin with. Is there anything below “B” stock?

I’m pretty salty about the whole thing. I’ve never had a bad experience buying or selling here in many years.

 

[jaymandude]

This happens a lot with old K's and A's, but I've never seen it with newer cymbals. I understand your frustration but I would try and breath for a sec. I think it's just a factory error ( not B stock at all) that they didn't catch. I don't see it as a bad buyng experience but I'm not you.

If it were me, I'd use a rat tail file to enlarge the hole just enough to fit. And then use so finishing sandpaper just to finalize the smoothness. I don't see it as modifying a factory cymbal since it should be like that in the first place.

Again, that's me. I've done it with expensive K's. Other people don't..

 

[Evdoggydog15]

Did you pay via paypal as "goods and services"? A good number of Agops being passed around on the used market are dogs. It's not Paiste level quality control we're dealing with.

If getting your money back somehow is not a possibility, I would look into hi hat rod thickness. It's possible that these DW stands are 7mm and larger than a typical 6mm rod. OR the 7000 is 6mm and the 5000 is 7mm and the cymbal is just defective. If I was you, I'd walk into the nearest music store and put the cymbal on a bunch of stands. If it doesn't fit any, I'd demand my money back. Paypal may consider this a defective product or "not as described" , but you may have to prove it. Good luck.

 

[Seb77]

That's odd, you'd think they would have a standard punch, and they also need the right hole size to put a cymbal on the lathe to start with.

I'd say if it sounds the way you like, keep it and have the hole enlarged by an metalworker. Should take just a few seconds.
If the sound is so-so, you should be able to return it.

 

[swayed1]

That's odd, you'd think they would have a standard punch, and they also need the right hole size to put a cymbal on the lathe to start with.

I'd say if it sounds the way you like, keep it and have the hole enlarged by an metalworker. Should take just a few seconds.
If the sound is so-so, you should be able to return it.

That's the thing that is frustrating - I can't even tell what it sounds like because the bottom cymbal is so stiff and choked.

 

[Butch1970]

I don't know if I've ever dealt with this on an Agop, but I have on a few vintage A's and K's. I got a hand reamer from Ace Hardware and used it to open up the center hole a bit so that it would fit on modern cymbal stands. Not saying that this is what you "have" to do, but it's an option.

 

[JDA]

rat tail file take 30 seconds and solved.
run it back and forth -try it
down and up real gentle
repeat until it's on.

 

[deepsoulradio]

Use a round file. Done it many times on vintage cymbals. Clean and easy.

Something like this

 

[swayed1]

Deepsoul, JDA, Butch1970, and others... Thanks for all the suggestions and while I appreciate your confidence, I'm just not comfortable filing down this cymbal.

The original owner and DFO seller (who has been great btw) put me in touch with Scott at Istanbul Agop. I sent him an email explaining the situation (and a link to this thread) and he replied within 10 minutes. Astonishing. Scott explained that they use a step bit to drill to the exact depth and (obviously) that didn't happen here. In his 16 years he said he has definitely seen this only a handful of times but never on a set of hats. Scott offered to send me a prepaid FedEx box so Istanbul can correct the issue and then return the hats to me. I am blown away! All the credit in the world to Istanbul for remedying this situation. What a great company. Will update the thread when I get them back!

 

[lossforgain]

That’s the best possible news for sure. I hope you end up loving them!

 

[dogmanaut]

Awesome. That’s great news — and not just for you; it’s encouraging to see a company handle something like this so well.

I was going to say earlier, if you do keep these hats, I think you’ll be very pleased with them. 15” Agop Sigs are pretty special cymbals, IMHO. Some of my favorite hats ever.

Anyway, glad things got resolved.

 

[Ron_M]

If you want a proper 1/2" hole, use a t-handle reamer, and run it through. I've done this many times with vintage As, and it works like a charm. I use a deburring tool to finish the edges, but it's not necessary.

General Tools Steel T-Handle Reamer 1/8 to 1/2 in. 1/8 in.-1/2 1 pc. - Ace Hardware

www.acehardware.com

 

[JazzDrumGuy]

I agree it should be right on such a nice cymbal. I've never had Agop hats so I don't know about their QC. I have had many Agop rides and they all have been fine in terms of the hole.

It doesn't make sense that the 9000 stand works but the other two don't. That's great that the company will fix the issue at no Charge. It's a simple fix with one of the above methods, or other methods (Dremel or sandpaper) but I understand you don't want to, nor should you have to, do it.

And it should have been disclosed that the two holes are different sized because clearly there's a discrepancy, but that's a different discussion.

Looking forward to the after pictures....

 

[multijd]

I’ve had this happen with a variety of stands, cymbals, sleeves/cups. There is a lot of variety.

 

[kevin klever]

WOW that is really a surprising level of customer service. Props to Agop for that, as well as for making great cymbals.

 

[hardbat]

Every Agop I've had or seen has a huge center hole. This one is obviously a glitch.

 

[Demonslayer]

Deepsoul, JDA, Butch1970, and others... Thanks for all the suggestions and while I appreciate your confidence, I'm just not comfortable filing down this cymbal.

The original owner and DFO seller (who has been great btw) put me in touch with Scott at Istanbul Agop. I sent him an email explaining the situation (and a link to this thread) and he replied within 10 minutes. Astonishing. Scott explained that they use a step bit to drill to the exact depth and (obviously) that didn't happen here. In his 16 years he said he has definitely seen this only a handful of times but never on a set of hats. Scott offered to send me a prepaid FedEx box so Istanbul can correct the issue and then return the hats to me. I am blown away! All the credit in the world to Istanbul for remedying this situation. What a great company. Will update the thread when I get them back!

Scott is top tier.

 

[JDA]

"Soon as he put down the phone he looked in his drawer for the reamer awaiting your cymbal to arrive."

kidding. that's a $3 don Rickles-style joke.
(may be true.. certainly not going to send it back to Turkey do you ya think? know? did he say....