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What is the secret sauce in a 20” Rogers bass drum?

JDA

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Dumpy just don't put any " sauce"..Actual Sauce in or around the drum.
 

Philaiy9

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I would love to hear a side-by-side comparison of a vintage Ludwig 20" with a Rogers 20". Same heads and tuning. I have a hard time believing they sound as radically different as some people claim. But I'd love to be proven wrong.
 

Drdrumdude3009

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I would love to hear a side-by-side comparison of a vintage Ludwig 20" with a Rogers 20". Same heads and tuning. I have a hard time believing they sound as radically different as some people claim. But I'd love to be proven wrong.

I haven’t done side by side with a Luddy from the same era, but I have listened to a house kit from a studio and until I saw it myself, I saw a 20” Rogers and not a 24” anything else.
 

D. B. Cooper

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Rogers formica wraps were, to me , an extra ply The glue they used was industrial rubber based , I've stripped those and brother , its very labour intensive . The edges were unique at that time to the Rogers brand .Machined hardened USA steel fittings .

The drums were the sum total of everything that went into them , and whether they intended to or not , a legendary brand was created , the 20" bass drum a good example . A real sweetheart .

I've tried Rogers copies and though margarine will cover your bread, it ain't butter .


If there was a Hall of Fame for posts on DFO, this would certainly qualify.
Beautifully said, man.


That, sir, is one of the best things I've read in a while.

Love it and will steal this line for use on my kids.

They will roll their eyes and laugh.

Haha, I had a similar reaction!
 

charlesm

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I would love to hear a side-by-side comparison of a vintage Ludwig 20" with a Rogers 20". Same heads and tuning. I have a hard time believing they sound as radically different as some people claim. But I'd love to be proven wrong.
That would be cool.

As a former, 10-year Rogers 20 owner, though, I can tell you there is a significant difference.

What Rogers has vs. the other brands of the day is *attack* and openness....due to the sharp bearing edges.

You hit a Rogers 20" kick and it just goes POW! Like artillery going off. Solid, loud, deep, open. Big sound. There's a subharmonic bass presence that is not quite there with the other brands.

I had a Ludwig '70s 3-ply kit with a 22" for a few years, and the Rogers 20" was a more powerful bass drum.

That's not to say that Rogers is a better sound. What it DOESN'T have is quite the same kind of warm, round thud of a Ludwig or Sling. Rogers is a little cleaner/more scooped in the mids.

GRETSCH 20s, however...interesting case. Got two here, a RB and a USAC. Very similar sounds. They have ALMOST as much of that "pow"/attack factor of the Rogers, plus they have a little more warmth and mid presence to my ears (gum vs. birch, perhaps?). As many people like to say about Gretsch, they walk a line, in a way, between a "vintage" and a modern sound.

IMO.
 

High on Stress

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That would be cool.

As a former, 10-year Rogers 20 owner, though, I can tell you there is a significant difference.

What Rogers has vs. the other brands of the day is *attack* and openness....due to the sharp bearing edges.

You hit a Rogers 20" kick and it just goes POW! Like artillery going off. Solid, loud, deep, open. Big sound. There's a subharmonic bass presence that is not quite there with the other brands.

I had a Ludwig '70s 3-ply kit with a 22" for a few years, and the Rogers 20" was a more powerful bass drum.

That's not to say that Rogers is a better sound. What it DOESN'T have is quite the same kind of warm, round thud of a Ludwig or Sling. Rogers is a little cleaner/more scooped in the mids.

GRETSCH 20s, however...interesting case. Got two here, a RB and a USAC. Very similar sounds. They have ALMOST as much of that "pow"/attack factor of the Rogers, plus they have a little more warmth and mid presence to my ears (gum vs. birch, perhaps?). As many people like to say about Gretsch, they walk a line, in a way, between a "vintage" and a modern sound.

IMO.
Interesting. In addition to being blown away by other people’s Rogers 20-inchers, I’ve been super underwhelmed by my own DW 20, which has a sharp edge but just doesn’t sound like much behind the kit (it sounds great to me on tape and also in the room according to various bandmates).

But … my other favorite bass drum is a beat up Gretsch SB that has much more punch, projection and a certain quality that my other 22s (including a’67 Ludwig) don’t quite have.
 

Philaiy9

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That would be cool.

As a former, 10-year Rogers 20 owner, though, I can tell you there is a significant difference.

What Rogers has vs. the other brands of the day is *attack* and openness....due to the sharp bearing edges.

You hit a Rogers 20" kick and it just goes POW! Like artillery going off. Solid, loud, deep, open. Big sound. There's a subharmonic bass presence that is not quite there with the other brands.

I had a Ludwig '70s 3-ply kit with a 22" for a few years, and the Rogers 20" was a more powerful bass drum.

That's not to say that Rogers is a better sound. What it DOESN'T have is quite the same kind of warm, round thud of a Ludwig or Sling. Rogers is a little cleaner/more scooped in the mids.

GRETSCH 20s, however...interesting case. Got two here, a RB and a USAC. Very similar sounds. They have ALMOST as much of that "pow"/attack factor of the Rogers, plus they have a little more warmth and mid presence to my ears (gum vs. birch, perhaps?). As many people like to say about Gretsch, they walk a line, in a way, between a "vintage" and a modern sound.

IMO.
Thanks for your perspective. If you don't mind my asking what heads were you running on those bass drums?
 

BennyK

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Closest tothe Rogers has been, in my experience, Premier 3-ply mahogany and / or Sonor 3-ply teardrops from the 60's . These two have a fat bottom end,jello on springs presence, but don't project that quality as far or as powerfully as the Rogers .
 

Bijan

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True old ground wood was pretty much a thing of the past when the Rogers kits were discussing were made.

I love 20” Rogers bass drums. They always sound great.
 

DamnSingerAlsoDrums

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That's what I was playing in the pic I used for my avatar... Boy that punchy 20" is a thing of beauty. I miss it each and everyday that I don't play it...
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charlesm

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Thanks for your perspective. If you don't mind my asking what heads were you running on those bass drums?

On the Rogers, I had a SuperKick for a while. Sounded great but a little too muffled. Then I put a coated Emad on it and the first time I hit it I almost fell on the floor. Sounded astonishing. Perfect modern rock/pop kick sound. Sounded like it was miked up. Kept that for a bunch of years, until I sold the kit. Reso was an Amb logo head with small port.

The Ludwig 22" had a coated PS batter most of the time and either PS reso or Fiberskyn reso. In retrospect, I don't think any of that was ideal for that drum. Should have just weńt with the classic coated Emp batter/Amb reso.

That's what I'm using now on the Gretsch 20s (and my MIJ 20) - coated Emp/coated Amb. More the sound I like these days and it works well with the Pratt muffler. Felt strips on reso. Small port. Powerful, open, lively tone that really projects. Rock to jazz with two turns of a couple of t-rods and Pratt adjusted. Very responsive and expressive relative to dynamics, beater type, etc.--moreso than with the pre-muffled heads.
 

Philaiy9

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On the Rogers, I had a SuperKick for a while. Sounded great but a little too muffled. Then I put a coated Emad on it and the first time I hit it I almost fell on the floor. Sounded astonishing. Perfect modern rock/pop kick sound. Sounded like it was miked up. Kept that for a bunch of years, until I sold the kit. Reso was an Amb logo head with small port.

The Ludwig 22" had a coated PS batter most of the time and either PS reso or Fiberskyn reso. In retrospect, I don't think any of that was ideal for that drum. Should have just weńt with the classic coated Emp batter/Amb reso.

That's what I'm using now on the Gretsch 20s (and my MIJ 20) - coated Emp/coated Amb. More the sound I like these days and it works well with the Pratt muffler. Felt strips on reso. Small port. Powerful, open, lively tone that really projects. Rock to jazz with two turns of a couple of t-rods and Pratt adjusted. Very responsive and expressive relative to dynamics, beater type, etc.--moreso than with the pre-muffled heads.
I also had the experience of my Ludwig 22" sounding anemic with a PS3/PS3. Moving to a combo of Emperor/Ambassador w/ felt strips really gave the drum some nice punch and presence. My theory is that all bass drums with rounded edges would benefit from slightly more open heads due to less head vibration by default.
 

charlesm

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I also had the experience of my Ludwig 22" sounding anemic with a PS3/PS3. Moving to a combo of Emperor/Ambassador w/ felt strips really gave the drum some nice punch and presence. My theory is that all bass drums with rounded edges would benefit from slightly more open heads due to less head vibration by default.

I absolutely agree! Makes sense that sharper edges (Rogers, Gretsch kicks) would be more forgiving of varied types of heads.

I can still remember the sound of a 3-ply 22" Lud kick we had in high school. Coated Ambs both sides with some shredded newspaper inside...great!
 

keith a

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The secret is using a PS3 on the batter side and a black shiny emperor with no hole on the reso side. Trust me. Punch beyond belief once you tune it right.
 

AtlantaDrumGuy

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My Rogers 20” has a port in front, and I have to say, it feels best that way to me. I have full front heads on some other kick drums, but it never feels as good. I think the differing factor with Rogers vs other vintage makes are the edges. Tend to have a wide tuning range and naturally more sustain. Not necessarily good or bad, but rather a characteristic of those drums.
 


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