What was Ringo's setup towards the end of the Beatles?

K.O.

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Information on Ringo's cymbals is sketchy at best. He himself doesn't seem to really know what he was using or when. In one interview he mentioned an "old Avedis". Beyond that it comes down to detective work looking at photos and what cymbals he still owns or cymbals reputed to have been his that he gave away.
Towards the end of the Beatles his cymbal setup sometimes had 1 or 2 more cymbals than he'd used in the touring years. I'm not sure it has been determined whether those were all his own cymbals or if he was augmenting his personal setup with cymbals that were available at Abbey Road.
 

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I think all of The Beatles were obsessed with matching the superior sound (as they saw it) of American records. So I wouldn't be surprised if Ringo was as disposed to Zildjian as he obviously was to Ludwig. The story that Keltner gave him some Paiste to play could be true, I don't know.
 

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I'd suspect that Ringo eventually came around to playing Zildjians but it seems doubtful he did so at the beginning.
It's quite possible that he didn't even encounter any Zildjians prior to late 1963 or early 64. They would have been expensive compared to the home grown Zyns, Kruts, etc. It's easy to think that there's no way he'd have settled for those once he had some money but he may not have known any different. If the music stores in Liverpool only stocked British (or European made) cymbals then that's all those local drummers would know. If that's all the store has and all you were exposed to then you'd have no way of knowing there were better cymbals to be had. It would just be "well, this is a cymbal and this is what it sounds like, and I guess that's what they are supposed to sound like". How would you know any different? Once exposed to higher end cymbals you would figure it out but before then not so much. As stated Ringo wasn't ever a hard core "gear nut" anyhow. He did continue to use one cymbal that appears to be some sort of a Zyn at least up through the filming of a Hard Day's Night so even after he had discovered the charms of Zildjians he apparently wasn't in any big hurry to dump what he had been using.

Most of those UK cymbals pale in comparison to Zildjians or (Paistes) when heard up close by a discerning ear. But they do sound, more or less, like a "cymbal" when heard from a distance within a screaming audience or within a studio recording when part of a mix ( and not close miked). That's likely all that mattered to Ringo at the time he was shelling out his own money to buy them.

At some point it would sink in that Zildjian (or whomever) was the "best" and he, as the drummer of the world's biggest band should use the "best" but that seems to have been a bit later on.

My thoughts anyway as someone who has wasted entirely too much time pondering such things.
 
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Ludwigboy

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I agree, I think he played Zyn, Paiste and the like
It's Ringo himself who claims he was all Zildjian, even though we know there were others. The first time we talked about cymbals in 1995, he said he played all "Avedis" and showed me his hi hats that he said were from 1960 and I quote, "On all the records." But yes, he definitely used Zyn and we believe Paiste 602s, but my understanding is that was earlier and by Let It Be and Abbey Road, he was using all A. Zildjians.

As stated above, I'd heard the opposite regarding Paiste. That he used them earlier. I always thought by or after Sgt. Pepper (1968/1969) he was using all A. Zildjians. My understanding is he gifted some or all of his 602s to Jim Keltner. I'm going to ask Jim. Ringo once kidded me about playing Paiste in the old days. This was over 20 years ago, so "the old days" could have meant 1969 or 1963. But like Charlie, Ringo didn't pay much or any attention to the specifics of what he used when, so it's hard to get definitive answers. Gary has done a great job, but some of it is like flying blind.

I agree, I think he played Zyn, Paiste and the like in the "early days", but what is interesting is what Ringo said to you, John (DeChristopher), above about a set of 1960 Zildjian hi hats... "On all the records". So Ringo was playing Zildjian at one point and had access to Zildjian at one point to get these hihats.

Would he have bought these hihats used? Maybe....

Would they have come with the 1960 Premier Mahogany Duroplastic set as they are the same year of manufacture...maybe? If so, he had access to Zildjian then, why not later...

After the Ed Sullivan Show and the two U.S. concerts and buying the 2nd Downbeat oyster black pearl set from Manny's in New York , he would have had access to Zildjians.

Maybe in the future, this will be clarified.... a lot of maybe's..

Just some more points to make our heads spin.....;):p
 

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ThomFloor

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Ok about Ringo's drums.
I find that Thermogloss kit setup to be quite awkward looking. The 2 toms are on a stand, but the entire stand is sitting IN FRONT of his bass drum.
Toms off a bass drum mount are never that far out and away from the drummer. It always bothered me.

cymbals - I recall reading a segment of an engineer who recorded Ringo in the 70's for somebody else's record.
He unpacked and setup Ringos' kit and said his cymbals were all very dirty, the dirtiest he'd seen.
 
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JDA

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cheap chancers
mix it with your Avedis
and get a Beatle haircut

make it Quick price will rise as soon as I hit Enter.


I warned you Only three on the entire internet.
4 if you include Youngstownshrimp who wants $197

This could be Your big Break. In ten years you can put in title not bonham not peart ..but looks like a Ringo? and ask $500....
I'm half-tempted myself.
 
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JDA

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K.O.

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I agree, I think he played Zyn, Paiste and the like in the "early days", but what is interesting is what Ringo said to you, John (DeChristopher), above about a set of 1960 Zildjian hi hats... "On all the records". So Ringo was playing Zildjian at one point and had access to Zildjian at one point to get these hihats.

Would he have bought these hihats used? Maybe....

Would they have come with the 1960 Premier Mahogany Duroplastic set as they are the same year of manufacture...maybe? If so, he had access to Zildjian then, why not later...

After the Ed Sullivan Show and the two U.S. concerts and buying the 2nd Downbeat oyster black pearl set from Manny's in New York , he would have had access to Zildjians.

But there is a pair of Arbiter hi-hats (the Drum City "house" brand, which I believe were made by Paiste) that were gifted to Jim Keltner that were supposedly used "on all the records".

So there's that. This all goes back to the core problem with figuring out Ringo's cymbals. Ringo doesn't seem to really know the details and neither does anyone else that's alive today.

Maybe he lucked onto a pair of Zildjian Hi-hats early on somehow, but then what's deal with that other pair?
 
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K.O.

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Ok about Ringo's drums.
I find that Thermogloss kit setup to be quite awkward looking. The 2 toms are on a stand, but the entire stand is sitting IN FRONT of his bass drum.
Toms off a bass drum mount are never that far out and away from the drummer. It always bothered me.

The toms were on that stand to get them way out front like that. Ringo is pretty short, yet has his throne set very high. To reach the bass drum pedal he has to sit really close to the bass drum. That makes it so the front half of the snare overhangs the bass drum and the mounted tom(s) need to be placed way forward of where drummers typically put them. He did this on his oyster sets too with the rail arm on set #1 running almost totally folded flat to push the tom as far forward as possible. On the other three OBP sets the Rogers swivo mount modification he had implemented facilitated that type of tom placement. With the Hollywood set he used a floor stand to get the job done.
 
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TPC

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All this Zildjian/Arbiter/Paiste/Krut discussion is interesting from a historical perspective. But it does highlight something. We've all heard these records a bazillion times, and we're gear geeks, and even WE can't tell if they're Zildjian or Paiste, or whatever, based on the sound. Can all agree that, once it's recorded, compressed, and set in the mix, a decent, thin 20" is basically the same as any other decent, thin 20" cymbal? (Ducks for cover.)
 

Ludwigboy

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All this Zildjian/Arbiter/Paiste/Krut discussion is interesting from a historical perspective. But it does highlight something. We've all heard these records a bazillion times, and we're gear geeks, and even WE can't tell if they're Zildjian or Paiste, or whatever, based on the sound. Can all agree that, once it's recorded, compressed, and set in the mix, a decent, thin 20" is basically the same as any other decent, thin 20" cymbal? (Ducks for cover.)

:D
 

K.O.

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But there is a pair of Arbiter hi-hats (the Drum City "house" brand, which I believe were made by Paiste) that were gifted to Jim Keltner that were supposedly used "on all the records".

So there's that. This all goes back to the core problem with figuring out Ringo's cymbals. Ringo doesn't seem to really know the details and neither does anyone else that's alive today.

Maybe he lucked onto a pair of Zildjian Hi-hats early on somehow, but then what's deal with that other pair?

Or maybe not on those Arbiters...just found this quote from Keltner

The hi-hats were a pair of Arbiters that said “602” on them. So they were early Paistes before they put their company name on their cymbals. They were given to Ringo, and he gave them to George. Ringo always played a beautiful Paiste 602 crash-ride, and his hi-hats are 14″ Zildjians that are so old you can barely see any logo. He preferred those, so he left the Arbiter Paiste hats with George. George had them in his studio for years. I used those hi-hats on everything I ever played with George?Cloud Nine – everything.

So maybe Ringo did score some old Zildjians relatively early on.

Although this line further muddies the waters

" Ringo always played a beautiful Paiste 602 crash-ride"
 
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type85

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But there is a pair of Arbiter hi-hats (the Drum City "house" brand, which I believe were made by Paiste) that were gifted to Jim Keltner that were supposedly used "on all the records".

So there's that. This all goes back to the core problem with figuring out Ringo's cymbals. Ringo doesn't seem to really know the details and neither does anyone else that's alive today.

Maybe he lucked onto a pair of Zildjian Hi-hats early on somehow, but then what's deal with that other pair?

"Arbiter Ltd." and "Dallas–Arbiter" were the UK importers and distributors for Paiste. There were 4 different Arbiter stamped Paiste lines starting in 1962, Paiste added "custom" above the Paiste logo stamp (with the exception of the "Stambul" line), please see the Paiste wiki link below for accurate and detailed information.


Ringo's "Paiste connection" was almost certainly though the "Arbiter Ltd."/"Dallas–Arbiter" music store in London.
 

Whitten

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Can all agree that, once it's recorded, compressed, and set in the mix, a decent, thin 20" is basically the same as any other decent, thin 20" cymbal? (Ducks for cover.)

Nooooooo.
In the beginning Ringo's drums were recorded by two mics I think, one over the kit (a rather cheap AKG D19) and one pointing at the bass drum.
The tape machine was two track, then four track. The drum performance was copied tape to tape a lot of times!
Even later on they were using D19's or Coles ribbons as overheads and 8 track tape machines.
These days we are using very detailed, high quality mics, and often four or more JUST over the cymbals. Digital is harsher sounding, clinical and much less forgiving than tape. By the time you've copied drums tape to tape, in order to free up more tracks, you've lost detail and high end.
 

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Looking forward to the "Get back" documentary, took this screenshot of the trailer, neither of those look like Zildjians!

View attachment 524710

In this picture, Ringo is playing a 20" Pre-serial Paiste 602 Medium Ride, 20" Zyn with 5 rivets, 1960 Zildjian Hi Hats 14"

IMG_5237.JPG

you can see the "medium ride" at around 3 o'clock on the rooftop.

Could it be this one he received Christmas 1965 London show?

PHOTO-2021-01-22-00-10-16.jpg


20" Zyn with 5 rivets
IMG_5337.PNG

It's probably the one he used all over Sgt. Pepper album
PHOTO-2021-01-03-12-41-45.jpg
 

GiantBeater

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Ringo eventually added his 18" Zildjian crash ride by the time they were in the apple basement.
PHOTO-2020-12-23-22-03-29.jpg

even here, you can see the distinctive 602 hammering on the far left. the zyn is Ns12 alloy so you can see the color difference in each cymbal.
PHOTO-2020-12-22-17-54-26.jpg

looks like Ringo temporarily added a paiste children's 12" cymbal
 


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