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What's the latest status of the Paiste Cymbal Cleaner and Protector?

michiganice91

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I'm guessing you haven't used it? With just the clesner I BELIEVE the finish of the cymbal is compromised.

Of course I've used it thats why I have the utmost confidence in saying it does absolutely nothing. As for "watching the artists who tour the facility" this amounts to pretty much nothing. I've talked to plenty of paiste artists who are just as ignorant about actual paiste-related facts as the individuals working in the Brea, CA office.

Im 99.9% confident in saying the factory applied coating in Nottwil bears little to no resemblance to whatever is being sold as "protector" in that blue bottle. What they apply at the factory is a true wax (carnauba) layer perhaps with a sort of lacquer applied too. Whats in the blue bottle is probably water with some thin wax that does nothing. Ive cleaned plenty of paistes with orange bottle, which is great stuff, and then applied copius amounts of protector only to have them oxidize on me a few days later.
 

Toast Tee

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Of course I've used it thats why I have the utmost confidence in saying it does absolutely nothing. As for "watching the artists who tour the facility" this amounts to pretty much nothing. I've talked to plenty of paiste artists who are just as ignorant about actual paiste-related facts as the individuals working in the Brea, CA office.

Im 99.9% confident in saying the factory applied coating in Nottwil bears little to no resemblance to whatever is being sold as "protector" in that blue bottle. What they apply at the factory is a true wax (carnauba) layer perhaps with a sort of lacquer applied too. Whats in the blue bottle is probably water with some thin wax that does nothing. Ive cleaned plenty of paistes with orange bottle, which is great stuff, and then applied copius amounts of protector only to have them oxidize on me a few days later.
You come off very angry. I don't know why, and if you are it's none of my business. I'm not selling the stuff. It sold.
I would NEVER use anything besides Paiste cymbal cleaner on my collection.
You're going to think, and believe what you want.
I will warn, if you use anything other than Paiste's cleaner, and protector (not just the cleaner)....At the very least you risk resale value.
I believe it's the Drumeo tource/Jared when Paiste says the protector used on the cymbals, is the same protector as the factory.
 

bodinski

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Curiously, the partial bottle of Protector I’ve been nursing is considerably thicker than the previous bottles I’ve used. I can’t say if it works any better, though. Once the factory finish starts to tarnish, this does little to stop it returning.
 

michiganice91

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You come off very angry. I don't know why, and if you are it's none of my business. I'm not selling the stuff. It sold.
I would NEVER use anything besides Paiste cymbal cleaner on my collection.
You're going to think, and believe what you want.
I will warn, if you use anything other than Paiste's cleaner, and protector (not just the cleaner)....At the very least you risk resale value.
I believe it's the Drumeo tource/Jared when Paiste says the protector used on the cymbals, is the same protector as the factory.

Unfortunately text does a poor job at conveying tone compared to other forms of communication such as speech or visual communication, so I suppose some of that is up to the reader to try and interpret.

I just know when people get their information from sources like Jared Falk, various paiste endorsers, employees of paiste, and yes even Erik Paiste himself, they're often wrong when it comes to the sheer truth. A lot of this stems from people not wanting to jeopardize themselves by speaking the truth in public.

It's absolutely not true that other cleaners can't be used on Paistes. I've personally started using MOTHERS chrome polish which is far more mild than Paiste orange bottle with great success. I've also started using FLITZ metal polish and its worked especially well on my paiste reflectors even better than the orange bottle.

Once you know that paistes factory coating is mostly wax with some lacquer you only need to find a nice automotive polish with carnauba wax to use as a sealer which produces the same protective effect as paiste factory coating. My issue with the blue bottle protector is that it seems to be extremely weak compared to what they actually put on at the factory. If you also consider a purely economic standpoint, how does paiste sell more cymbals if people don't buy them as frequently because they're preserved? So in my opinion some of this stuff is just pure marketing with smoke and mirrors. If you want people to buy more cymbals, you want them to have a shorter lifespan from a purely capitalist perspective.

Back to paiste artists and factory tours, I've never personally been to nottwil, but I've seen nearly every video showing the factory online out there and notice that NONE of them ever show anything but a RUDE or 2oo2 being made which I find very strange and curious.

Paiste on a whole is very secretive about their production methods and alloy sourcing. I understand there is a need to protect proprietary information but still I would love to know some basic details that they simply wont go on the record about.

I can recommend several people who aren't so public you could speak with if you want a lot of actual truths and non-public details on your favorite paiste products and history. Forgive me if I sounded angry or frustrated or whatever. I simply want people to have the truth about paiste since its my favorite drum related company instead of just believing everything thats shoveled at us through marketing and online videos for the masses.
 

TechDad

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I recently purchased 3 bottles from Morgan’s music Store. It was all they had. I re-sold 2 on the bay for exactly enough as to make the one bottle free for us after all said and done. As for the product itself; I can tell you for sure that if you take a vintage(40’s 50’s 60’s) A series cymbal and clean off all the patina with say BKF or the like, bringing it to a brilliant shine, assuming it’s meant to be, then apply a thin coat of Protectant every 6 months or so for us, it will stay that way aside from regular actual ‘cleaning’ which for us removes finger prints and stick marks, and has not as much to do with ‘polish’ per se. It very simply applies a thin layer between bronze alloy and the air in the environment to slow the oxidation when applied correctly. I don’t really have too much personal opinion on Paiste as a company overall, and don’t care much about that I guess. (Btw, most our cymbals, but not all, retain nice patina though, tbh.) Picture below is of a Hollow Logo Quick Beat set we purposely polished and clean the top and leave the bottom dark and patina’d. The top has protectant. The Big Beats get a touch every once in a Blue Moon with Protectant. We don’t possess nor use their cymbal cleaner, never have.
 

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Toast Tee

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I easily searched 3 months to find em too!
I hear ya. I had to go to Greece, and the Arctic lol.
I got good $ considering.
I really hope to hear from my Brother inlaw (wifes sisters.....) If there's any bottles left it's at the factory..
What else is great about the protector, ya just need a soft cloth after use.
I've read stories of people using other cleaners, and they regretted it.
Paiste had been hypocritical. They telll you to only use the Paiste products on Paiste cymbals. They stop making it, and tell ya to use something that's going to possibly ruin the cymbals
 

Toast Tee

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Unfortunately text does a poor job at conveying tone compared to other forms of communication such as speech or visual communication, so I suppose some of that is up to the reader to try and interpret.

I just know when people get their information from sources like Jared Falk, various paiste endorsers, employees of paiste, and yes even Erik Paiste himself, they're often wrong when it comes to the sheer truth. A lot of this stems from people not wanting to jeopardize themselves by speaking the truth in public.

It's absolutely not true that other cleaners can't be used on Paistes. I've personally started using MOTHERS chrome polish which is far more mild than Paiste orange bottle with great success. I've also started using FLITZ metal polish and its worked especially well on my paiste reflectors even better than the orange bottle.

Once you know that paistes factory coating is mostly wax with some lacquer you only need to find a nice automotive polish with carnauba wax to use as a sealer which produces the same protective effect as paiste factory coating. My issue with the blue bottle protector is that it seems to be extremely weak compared to what they actually put on at the factory. If you also consider a purely economic standpoint, how does paiste sell more cymbals if people don't buy them as frequently because they're preserved? So in my opinion some of this stuff is just pure marketing with smoke and mirrors. If you want people to buy more cymbals, you want them to have a shorter lifespan from a purely capitalist perspective.

Back to paiste artists and factory tours, I've never personally been to nottwil, but I've seen nearly every video showing the factory online out there and notice that NONE of them ever show anything but a RUDE or 2oo2 being made which I find very strange and curious.

Paiste on a whole is very secretive about their production methods and alloy sourcing. I understand there is a need to protect proprietary information but still I would love to know some basic details that they simply wont go on the record about.

I can recommend several people who aren't so public you could speak with if you want a lot of actual truths and non-public details on your favorite paiste products and history. Forgive me if I sounded angry or frustrated or whatever. I simply want people to have the truth about paiste since its my favorite drum related company instead of just believing everything thats shoveled at us through marketing and online videos for the masses.
All good. There's no affect, so it's hard to put feelings in writing. I'm dyslexic, so I have no idea how I'm coming off more often than not
 

TechDad

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I hear ya. I had to go to Greece, and the Arctic lol.
I got good $ considering.
I really hope to hear from my Brother inlaw (wifes sisters.....) If there's any bottles left it's at the factory..
What else is great about the protector, ya just need a soft cloth after use.
I've read stories of people using other cleaners, and they regretted it.
Paiste had been hypocritical. They telll you to only use the Paiste products on Paiste cymbals. They stop making it, and tell ya to use something that's going to possibly ruin the cymbals

I totally agree with your assessment. That’s sort of why I have no opinion on them necessarily overall as a company. I try not to watch too too many marketing videos, and when I do I try to keep in mind who is putting it on and perhaps why they do so. I’ve been reading this forum and others like it for decades without posting, just reading. I like the Protectant, but if I study on their practices, I’m pretty sure I’d get a bad taste in my mouth about it, just because I usually tend to.I know me well!
 

Toast Tee

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I totally agree with your assessment. That’s sort of why I have no opinion on them necessarily overall as a company. I try not to watch too too many marketing videos, and when I do I try to keep in mind who is putting it on and perhaps why they do so. I’ve been reading this forum and others like it for decades without posting, just reading. I like the Protectant, but if I study on their practices, I’m pretty sure I’d get a bad taste in my mouth about it, just because I usually tend to.I know me well!
I actually spoke to the warehouse in Cali. I was assured it would be available in Jan '19.
I don't see Paiste in Music stores anymore either (maybe an 18 2002, or a Sig Full), except the Hollywood Sam Ash.
I do love the cymbals sound though.
I've had the feeling they may be struggling, especially since Meinl had gotten so big, so fast
 

TechDad

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I actually spoke to the warehouse in Cali. I was assured it would be available in Jan '19.
I don't see Paiste in Music stores anymore either (maybe an 18 2002, or a Sig Full), except the Hollywood Sam Ash.
I do love the cymbals sound though.
I've had the feeling they may be struggling, especially since Meinl had gotten so big, so fast
Lol. It’s likely I’ve read plenty of your conversations about it over the last few years then, since you mention it, though I don’t recall screen names necessarily. I similarly went on a quest/search for it. I sold the two bottles recently on the bay for $40 each, full, and like said, was pretty content just having one bottle for us for free in the end, and hopefully supplying two other drummers/collectors with something they also were looking for at a price too expensive for what it is, yet reasonable considering supply/demand/availability.
 

Toast Tee

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Lol. It’s likely I’ve read plenty of your conversations about it over the last few years then, since you mention it, though I don’t recall screen names necessarily. I similarly went on a quest/search for it. I sold the two bottles recently on the bay for $40 each, full, and like said, was pretty content just having one bottle for us for free in the end, and hopefully supplying two other drummers/collectors with something they also were looking for at a price too expensive for what it is, yet reasonable considering supply/demand/availability.
That was a steal for whoever got them!.
With my luck, I'll find enough to fill a shipping container, and 2 weeks later they'll reintroduce the products.
Eh, I'd still take the risk lol
 

TechDad

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That was a steal for whoever got them!.
With my luck, I'll find enough to fill a shipping container, and 2 weeks later they'll reintroduce the products.
Eh, I'd still take the risk lol
I imagine if you somehow figure out their logistical problem for them and manage enough to re-supply all the retailers before they can you’d stand to make out pretty well. I’d do that too.
 

Deafmoon

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I too saw the stuff going on eBay for ridiculous pricing. Then I remembered hearing that it was watered down, so I walked away. I contacted Paiste earlier this year and they said they were still working on getting it again. They don’t make it, they just bought it and distributed it. Maybe the maker stopped producing it. ? I’ve heard people say they clean Paiste’s with Ketchup, Coca Cola, Vinegar & water and Krud Kutter Graffitti Remover. Just don’t use Groove Juice, that crap destroys finishes.
 

Toast Tee

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I too saw the stuff going on eBay for ridiculous pricing. Then I remembered hearing that it was watered down, so I walked away. I contacted Paiste earlier this year and they said they were still working on getting it again. They don’t make it, they just bought it and distributed it. Maybe the maker stopped producing it. ? I’ve heard people say they clean Paiste’s with Ketchup, Coca Cola, Vinegar & water and Krud Kutter Graffitti Remover. Just don’t use Groove Juice, that crap destroys finishes.
There are all kinds of "Hacks" on YouTube. Some may; make them look good for a period, but all thst they really did (on Paiste) was remove the protective coating.
I had a feeling people were going to water it down, or put something else in it.
I made a video opening the cases from Paiste.
Shoot, if I were desperate I'd still buy it watered-down, as the directions call for water.
As for the protector, it will have a strong smell of (lavender) that's unmistakable.
Scumbags like that ruin it for honest guy's who've actually searched.
Someone would need empty bottles to refil, and that would give it away as well
 

Torquey

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WHAT!?!?!?!?!? I have a few bottles for sale then!! I think I bought around 16 bottles or so from Guitar Center a year or so ago, as I negotiated a deal! If I thought it was going to disappear, I would have bought a trailer full of the stuff! It works great on my Vintage gong!
20210419_090835.jpg
 

ppfd

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I’ve got a bottle each, has to be at least 10 years old, never used.
Think its still good?
 

Toast Tee

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Alright. To get $240 for a bottle of each....If you had 10 cases of each, they would be gone in a few days. I wouldn't sell the cleaner w/out the protector though.
You'll be offered more, and no fault in taking it. Supply, and demand, plus someone selling their collection of cymbals would easily make that $ back in resale.
Another reason I didn't say anything
 


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