Why hasn’t Paiste recreated the SCDR?

JDA

DFO Star
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
23,547
Reaction score
12,512
Location
Jeannette, Pa.
(cue Vincent Price music)

'Mystery Dark Ride...



(see text)
I have the theory about this cymbal number 1)
"Joe" this seller here should have some knowledge: where did he get it? who did he buy it from? did he have any conversation with whom he bought it from? but here is what I think it is and how it came to be.

An endorser asked for a 602 Dark Ride.
Long after they (Paiste) ceased production of them and this what they produced.
for him/her in 1985 (if serial still works that way)

Look at the hammering. is that 602 Dark definitive hammering to those knowledgeable of 602 Dark hammering?.
sure is distinctive and not really Sound Creation-like) So pure 602 Dark Ride. Just built long after
lol
Seller should know that or pressed and got better info from paiste
 
Last edited:

TPC

Very well Known Member
Joined
Aug 8, 2019
Messages
787
Reaction score
1,026
Location
San Pablo, CA
I would like to understand this more. If it’s not too much trouble could you explain this further?
I think it means that, because the hammer blows are so hard and they create such violent indentations, the metal needs to recover for a bit before it is hit again, or else it’ll crack. “Stress hardening” (what we used to call it in engineering school) is creating some brittleness until the metal/crystal is allowed to relax.

Ergo, time consuming. Time vs. money. Failure rate vs. profit margin. Etc

Or not.
 

311Club

Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2020
Messages
19
Reaction score
38
I have the theory about this cymbal number 1)
"Joe" this seller here should have some knowledge: where did he get it? who did he buy it from? did he have any conversation with whom he bought it from? but here is what I think it is and how it came to be.

An endorser asked for a 602 Dark Ride.
Long after they (Paiste) ceased production of them and this what they produced.
for him/her in 1985 (if serial still works that way)

Look at the hammering. is that 602 Dark definitive hammering to those knowledgeable of 602 Dark hammering?.
sure is distinctive and not really Sound Creation-like) So pure 602 Dark Ride. Just built long after
lol
Seller should know that or pressed and got better info from paiste
Most likely the original owner sent his 1975 602 Dark Ride to the factory for a thorough cleaning. After cleaning Paiste will reapply the logos. They will use what is the current logo style, so not in every case what the cymbal came with originally. You can easily spot the embossed 602 logo under the blue label.
I have a couple of cymbals like this, my SC Dark Ride is from 79 and has both the embossed and the ink logo. Same with a pre-serial 602 Medium that has blue label logos.
Not sure if Paiste still offers this service. it used to cost 50 bucks (Swiss)

You'll see the "double" logo on my Dark Ride on the right

20150101_222824.jpg
 
Last edited:

JDA

DFO Star
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
23,547
Reaction score
12,512
Location
Jeannette, Pa.


my mistake: the Paiste 602 ink (thought it was Blue) is Black.

that ring of hammering near the edge is a character of the unique to the 602 Dark Ride correct?
So that's "just" a very late 602 Dark Ride maybe one of the last produced?

What year did that style of "602 Ink" first appear.


I don't think (...) another can be found with both the "602 (illuminating) star ink" and the SC-looking(?) "Dark Ride" ink


either one of the last or (far-fetched maybe) was sent back for a clean and reink as suggested..
 
Last edited:

michiganice91

Very well Known Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
572
Reaction score
278
Location
California
(cue Vincent Price music)

'Mystery Dark Ride...



(see text)
Overpriced 1975 602 dark ride that they inked in the late 80s or 90s with some ridiculous stamps lol
 

michiganice91

Very well Known Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
572
Reaction score
278
Location
California
they being Paiste? right?. you know that has happened you've seen before? ok that answers it
Absolutely. If someone else inked that then someone out there has perfect replica stamps. Its Absolutely a 1975 as well from the serial # with no words/text etched above it. Either it sat around and got inked a decade after production or it was sent back for their touch up service. I don't see any other possibilities.
 

Pounder

DFO Star
Joined
Aug 5, 2005
Messages
12,191
Reaction score
679
Location
Norman, OK
They don’t have a good association with b20. I think they would probably sell really well and they would be very expensive but if you look at this company they lean heavily on in-house production utilizing alloys that are much easier to create a consistent sound with.
 

JDA

DFO Star
Silver Supporting Member
Joined
Aug 7, 2005
Messages
23,547
Reaction score
12,512
Location
Jeannette, Pa.
its best offer don't forget
someday he'll budge; seen drastic price drops all across on some items in reverb

 
Last edited:

311Club

Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2020
Messages
19
Reaction score
38
Question to Paiste experts: was that Blue Ink 602 Logo in use in 1975


I don't see the 602 ink in your pic
I noticed that one hardly see the logo at all

Couldn't find pics on my laptop, so I had to go take new ones:

1979 Sound Creation 22" Dark Ride, both pre-81 embossed logo and post 81 ink logo. Black as it is a Sound Creation DR:
79 SC Double Logo.jpg


Logo, Model and Serial number:
79 SC Logo and Serial.jpg


1979 Serial Number (89 would have had "PAISTE" stamped above the number http://www.cymbal.wiki/wiki/File:1987_Sound_Creation_Serial.jpg)
1979 Serial Number.jpg
 

311Club

Member
Joined
Oct 13, 2020
Messages
19
Reaction score
38
Exhibit B: Pre-Serial, Blue Label F602 20" Medium:
F602 20 M.jpg

ain't she pretty?

Double Logo:
Double F602 Logo.jpg


Pre-Serial:
No Serial.jpg


As for the black ink on the F602 DR I don't know. Paiste used to do all kinds of things for you if you asked nicely. Possibly someone asked for black ink and they obliged.
 

michiganice91

Very well Known Member
Joined
Dec 16, 2017
Messages
572
Reaction score
278
Location
California
Exhibit B: Pre-Serial, Blue Label F602 20" Medium:
View attachment 503182
ain't she pretty?

Double Logo:
View attachment 503183

Pre-Serial:
View attachment 503185

As for the black ink on the F602 DR I don't know. Paiste used to do all kinds of things for you if you asked nicely. Possibly someone asked for black ink and they obliged.
Is that your 20 Medium? Thats actually pretty wild because I also have a 20" blue label medium with NO SERIAL that IS NOT a pre-serial. For some reason it just has no serial number at all but no 602 embossed metal underneath a double stamp either. Pretty wild stuff...
 

toddlittle827

Well-Known Member
Joined
Nov 17, 2016
Messages
118
Reaction score
112
Location
United States
Not much mystery. that Dark Ride is definitely from 1975 (no other accounting for that serial number and serial style) and at some point was given the silk screen logos at the Paiste factory. Either the owner sent it in as a special request or it was a NOS cymbal they found laying around at Paiste and sold off after putting the new logos on. There are many instances of them doing this (silk screening over the original embossed metal stamp logos). I've seen quite a few Black Label 505s that were redone in green ink (factory leftovers) made to look brand new. Prior to that there are many leftover metal stamped Dixies and Stambuls that were ink stamped as 404s and 505s (again factory leftovers from a time of transition) above the bell.

Whoever did the logos knew it was a 602 but got the logos done in black like a Sound Creation. Pretty cool. I would've done the same.

As for the Blue label 602 with no serial, an oddity but sometimes they just didn't put a serial on. worker error.
 


Top