Worst brushes ever, avoid like the plague

gmiller598

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You are taking this personally. I am pointing more at the terrible product from innovative percussion. Companies that put out a badly made product such as this from innovative percussion deserve the bad reputations they create for themselves. People that try to silence details have their own agendas. Bad products equals bad reputations. innovative percussion put out a bad product and the buyer still has not received his money back. That is the point. Who has the money.
the point is branding 1 item bad and saying the entire product and company is trash. I’m not debating he received a bad item. Everyone will turn out a subpar item from time to time. The issue is with trashing a company before even giving them an opportunity to correct it.

If they refuses to correct it and deny that it is a defective product then people deserve to be warned.

I literally just bought a “new” used drumset from a major retailer who sent it to an apartment I lived at 15 years ago without requiring a signature. I had to essentially go steal it back from the doorstep halfway across town to prevent it from going missing and I then worked with the company to give them an opportunity to make it right. They gave me a very good price on an already deeply discounted matching snare drum for the set. They were very polite and apologetic through the entire process to make it right.

I understand that sometime there are issues that occur and I will put more weight behind how a company treats me in the process to resolve it than to swear to avoid a company and product completely before even attempting to speak with them to address the issue.

I also believe it completely fair to wait to provide a review of companies and products at the end of the process when all information is known.
 

MrYikes

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concerning a terrible product from innovative percussion: Your points are well taken (and I know it is difficult to defend shoddy products), but let's reverse the positions. Let's say the buyer paid for the product with counterfeit money. Would the retailer quietly ask the buyer to return and pay with good money? Or would he loudly proclaim this buyer uses bad money? While also trying to get his product back.
 

gmiller598

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concerning a terrible product from innovative percussion: Your points are well taken (and I know it is difficult to defend shoddy products), but let's reverse the positions. Let's say the buyer paid for the product with counterfeit money. Would the retailer quietly ask the buyer to return and pay with good money? Or would he loudly proclaim this buyer uses bad money? While also trying to get his product back.
I think I’m failing to see a connection. If a retailer loses product through theft, counterfeit money, or just gives it away it gets written off in their financial statements. Of course if the amount of such loss is significant enough then it becomes a criminal event that authorities will be involved in. In the event of a $30 pair of brushes it would just be written off as a loss.
 

jansara

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Wow! So much for trying to warn fellow drummers of a potentially faulty product. Didn’t expect a bunch of aggressiveness.
I (the customer) have to waste hours of my time ordering and resolving this and these companies couldn’t spend a mere 2 seconds looking at what they are selling? That is indefensible- and any arguments to the contrary are indicative of what has become endemic in our society- that it is ok to sell garbage and rip off consumers. Go ahead and waste your time and money, don’t waste mine with your weak attempts at defending gross incompetence.:mad:
Have you contacted the seller?

If you have, did you assume the same aggressive tone you displayed in your initial post? What was their response when you told them you will avoid them like the plague?

If you haven't, trashing them here is a waste of your time.
 

rayboomboom

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From the top photo it looks like the shaft that "hides" the wires wasn't inserted into the back piece fully. Therefore the wires don't extend all the way, and don't get hidden properly. And I would imagine they came wrapped in packaging that would not expose the problem to the reseller. I would blame this on a quality control issue, it was missed in inspection.
I wouldn't say that they were crap, but I would contact the company with the photos you have and get a replacement.
Good luck.
 

davezedlee

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just to set the record straight, the worst brushes ever made were $40 in 1990 and were the white plastic-handled deluxe Vic Firth ones

the inner rubber washer on the ends slowly dissolved into a gooey tar-like substance that dissolved and stained everything that was stored in it

which ended up being my ENTIRE stick bag
 

ARGuy

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concerning a terrible product from innovative percussion: Your points are well taken (and I know it is difficult to defend shoddy products), but let's reverse the positions. Let's say the buyer paid for the product with counterfeit money. Would the retailer quietly ask the buyer to return and pay with good money? Or would he loudly proclaim this buyer uses bad money? While also trying to get his product back.
I have to admit, you had me going for a couple of posts. Nice try, but the counterfeit money angle pushed things over the edge.
 

cashmanbashman

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Not sure if they're still made, but Pro-Mark B600 "Nylo-Brush", or whatever they were called.
At one time, I was looking for a nylon brush, just to try it out and I came across these things.
Ugh.
No way to adjust how far the "wires" extend and they flop around, even when in use.
Eventually, the casing cracks and then they're not only garbage, they're IN the garbage.....can, that is.
….at least they didn't cost too much (another lesson in getting what you pay for).
If you ever run across a pair....run....far away.....like the wind...…



...:wacko::mad:
I bought a pair that some dude made in his garage I’m guessing and they were great. They really get the dust out of my car vents. They were not so good for drumming however.
 

Joe A

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I had the same problem with the Promark Nylobrushes. I sent them an email asking which plastic the handles were, so I could choose the correct glue to repair them, and they merely apologized and sent me a new pair. I love how portable they are; I used to carry them in my pocket.

And also with the VF brushes, then called "Jazz Brushes". They were actually quite heavy, to the point that JD Blair used them as beaters on tour with Shania Twain. As this pair has sentimental value, they currently lie disassembled until I can wash off the gunk and reassemble using something else for the plug.
1579751218805586068599034272788.jpg
 

ggmerino

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From the top photo it looks like the shaft that "hides" the wires wasn't inserted into the back piece fully. Therefore the wires don't extend all the way, and don't get hidden properly. And I would imagine they came wrapped in packaging that would not expose the problem to the reseller. I would blame this on a quality control issue, it was missed in inspection.
I wouldn't say that they were crap, but I would contact the company with the photos you have and get a replacement.
Good luck.
Actually the shafts are fully inserted, although they come apart easily. It is simply that the shaft is cut too short, and cut rather crooked to boot, Also, the hole in the shaft is too small for the notched rod to fit. Balls are different sizes and also attached crooked, etc. etc....

No satisfaction yet- Steve Weiss referred me to IP. IP asked for pics, which I sent, and I have not heard back. Sent a reminder today.
 

bongomania

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As far as "worst" brushes--a whimsical reminder that the original drumming brushes were re-purposed fly swatters. Presumably some players used brushes that had previously done some bug killing.
 

EvEnStEvEn

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Pro-Mark B600 "Nylo-Brush"
At one time, I was looking for a nylon brush, just to try it out and I came across these things.
Ugh.
No way to adjust how far the "wires" extend and they flop around, even when in use.
Eventually, the casing cracks
If you ever run across a pair....run.

I like those Pro-Mark Nylo-Brushes brushes just fine, have 2 pairs that lasted over 20 years and still going.
True, the casing may crack after time and usage, but I like their sound & feel. I easily repaired the cracked handles with electrical tape.
For wire, I like the Regal wood handle model.
 
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ARGuy

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Actually the shafts are fully inserted, although they come apart easily. It is simply that the shaft is cut too short, and cut rather crooked to boot, Also, the hole in the shaft is too small for the notched rod to fit. Balls are different sizes and also attached crooked, etc. etc....

No satisfaction yet- Steve Weiss referred me to IP. IP asked for pics, which I sent, and I have not heard back. Sent a reminder today.
I have to admit that I'm disappointed in Steve Weiss. Those brushes you received were defective. What they should have done was either refunded your money or sent you a new pair that they checked over first. Steve Weiss should be the ones to have to deal with IP, since they bought the brushes from IP, not you. If either of them want to take a look at your brushes, they can send you a prepaid box and ask if you could send them back.
Last week was the NAMM Show, so maybe you dealt with someone who doesn't know the right way to handle this situation, since everyone in charge was at the show. Same at IP. There have been a bunch of us here that have given you are hard time about the way you reacted to this situation, but I don't think any of us are okay with the brushes you received - I'm certainly not. The way I'm looking at it, you're just about at that point where you're having to work too hard to get this resolved. Please keep us informed.
 

Elvis

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I like those Pro-Mark Nylo-Brushes brushes just fine, have 2 pairs that lasted over 20 years and still going.
True, the casing may crack after time and usage, but I like their sound & feel. I easily repaired the cracked handles with electrical tape.
For wire, I like the Regal wood handle model.
More power2Ya Steve.
I couldn't stand the ones I had.
Much happier with the wood handled VF's I have now.
 

blueshadow

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QC issues happen everywhere and yeah it ticks you off when it happens to you. I ordered a pair of Levis direct from them because I can't find 36 inseam in stores. Ordered 34x36 and that's what I got...or what is printed on the jeans but comparing them to another pair of 34x34's they are the same length and about 2" wider. Yeah someone had one job to do and didn't get it done. Of course I washed them so no returns, I should have tried I suppose but didn't bother for $33 (wait weird the jeans were on sale and same price as the brushes lol) but I'm not writing off Levi's based on the one screw up....still mad though! So I can certainly see both sides to the story I always felt that way about Ludwig when people would bring up QC issues, I wanted to defend them, yet I certainly would be mad as well with some of the issues I've seen ...and some of the issues I've seen I'd live with but that's another topic I suppose. Hope IP comes through with refund or new brushes they do look like a cool concept.
 

Tanabata

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I have to admit that I'm disappointed in Steve Weiss. Those brushes you received were defective. What they should have done was either refunded your money or sent you a new pair that they checked over first. Steve Weiss should be the ones to have to deal with IP, since they bought the brushes from IP, not you. If either of them want to take a look at your brushes, they can send you a prepaid box and ask if you could send them back.
Last week was the NAMM Show, so maybe you dealt with someone who doesn't know the right way to handle this situation, since everyone in charge was at the show. Same at IP. There have been a bunch of us here that have given you are hard time about the way you reacted to this situation, but I don't think any of us are okay with the brushes you received - I'm certainly not. The way I'm looking at it, you're just about at that point where you're having to work too hard to get this resolved. Please keep us informed.
I agree that SW could have handled this. It's a different business since Steve passed.
 

ggmerino

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Well, so much for “keeping an open mind” and giving the seller a chance to correct their mistakes. I sent both Steve Weiss and Innovative Percussion emails. SW was very apologetic and then referred me to IP for a new set of brushes. IP Sent a nice reply and asked for pics and a receipt, which I sent. They never got back to me. Sent a reminder and a request for confirmation that they received the pics and receipt. Nothing.

I actually tried playing with them at a studio. They are too heavy, the mallet balls are unusable because the rod sticks out too far and the first time I pushed in the rod, the whole thing fell apart due to the two main tube pieces not being attached to each other. Nice medium weight on the wires though, between a Ludwig and a Vater brush :blush:

Only one thing to do with trash gotten from trash- that is to throw them in the trash. No excuse for these companies to not even glance at what is sent out the door and expecting customers to figure out their screw ups. My only recourse is no more business with either company and warning my fellow drummers.

I will not waste any more time on emails, pics etc., or this thread. Thanks and sayonara.
 

ARGuy

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I'll be the first to admit I was wrong. From everything I know about both these companies, I thought one of them would have stepped up. Steve Weiss sold you the brushes, so the way I see it, it's up to them to make things right with you. Asking you to take it up with IP is not the right way to handle this.
It’s unrealistic to expect every product that companies make or sell to be perfect, but it's not unrealistic to expect that they step up and make things right.
 

Mongrel

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Unbelievable this thread wasn't a "Hey, just had a great experience with Steve W music!" thread...

YOU: "Dear Steve, received THESE ugly step sisters in lieu of a proper set. Can you help me out?"

THEM: "Dear Mr. Merino, we are sending you out a new pair that has been thoroughly checked out by our knowledgeable staff no charge. We are forwarding your pictures to IP so they can evaluate their QC procedures. Please feel free to keep or discard the other pair. We appreciate your business and are VERY sorry for your inconvenience."

DONE
 

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