Paiste Chinas and Swishes

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I wanting to expand my knowledge about Paiste Chinas/Swishes so I'd thought I'd ask for opinions about the various models.

I've played some ...

2002/505 with the "square" bell. These tend to be loud, harsh, and very China-y.
602 - Round bell, more mellow and transparent.
SC - Weird, dry, quiet ???

But there are many that I have not had the opportunity to play that look wonderful. Please chime in with your experience. If you have sound/video, that'd be awesome, too.

Thanks.
 
Paiste Twenty's China's have a dry piercing sound.
No shimmer.
The T20 alloy proto is more 602ish.
My ideal would be a Blue Label 602.
Would be good with rivets.
Haven't seen many sigs though.
 
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I’m a Paiste lifer but am not knocked over by Chinas. Sure I’ve had them (still do) but tend to prefer the smaller ones. My favorite of those I’ve owned was a 16” 2002.
 
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The Paiste version of a China type
is kind of unique to them. There aren’t a lot of truly “trashy” ones, like a lot of other brands make. They tend to be smoother and can also be kinda clangy.

The Paiste swishes are very nice for a buttery smooth dark sound, but I found mine didn’t project well.

The Signature alloy chinas are usually pretty nice, but kind of a crash/China hybrid type sound.

The best chinas I’ve heard from them are the 18 and 22 Modern Essentials chinas. They SOUND and play like you’d think a China should.
 
Michigan - wow what a collection. Thanks for posting all those. I’m partial to the 2000’s and the Trad, but they all sound good.

Ptrick - we’ve talked about this and I love your idea of the ME’s in your electric group.

cdrum - 22” Trad is definitely on my radar.
 
pgm554 said:
Paiste Twenty's China's have a dry piercing sound.
No shimmer.
The T20 alloy proto is more 602ish.
My ideal would be a Blue Label 602.
Would be good with rivets.
Haven't seen many sigs though.
Click to expand...
I have a T20 prototype China that I just love. Light and smooth. Almost buttery.
 
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I’ve been really wanting a Trad swish, but they never pop up anymore. Maybe a Masters is the next best thing?
 
OK, here's my little story that contains Paiste swishes.

Maybe two years ago, I had the idea to get a swish. Heard the one of Mel Lewis (youtube of course, not live - and it's obviously not a Paiste) and fell in love with his sound. Liked the fact that Dizzy Gillespie owned one, which all his drummers had to play, and so on.
My main use would be to support harp solos in a bluesy rock band, just to have that 'deeper trashy ride' sound.

Comparing lots of videos on youtube - because there was no way to hear them in person - my choice pointed to the Paiste 2002 JR Robinson Swish ride. Really dark, what I liked. Or the Masters swish, as second choice. Prices for new ones are far over the top for me to spend for an 'effect cymbal' (it's not more, if you think about it). So, I looked for used ones and luckily found a 2002 swish in very good condition (like new). Of course, I had to buy additionally a 24 inch cymbal case, as I have never owned such large cymbals. That changed in the meantime as you can imagine.

But to stay on topic: I had no chance to rehearse with that swish, and it came like some of you might have already expected. We played in a small club with lots of glass walls, the ceiling above stage was a mirror. And the audience area was not even filled by half (was the last gig before COVID shut down, and people already stopped going to music events). Worst conditions for cymbals that you can think of. My main cymbal set (ride, hats, crashes) were really aggressive on stage, especially their heights. At the point, when a harp solo started and I went riding on this 2002 swish, the harp player went nuts and nearly left stage because he couldn't hear himself.

Looking back, my idea was just idiotic, and my playing was not good enough for such a cymbal. You have to keep yourself really back when you ride on a large swish. I knew it, but failed in performing. Maybe a single rehearsal would have helped. Or NOT to buy the most monstrous swish you can get from Paiste. Apart from 'power oversteer', the sound was fantastic. Exactly what I was looking for.

Then, I tried to find something more calm, more smooth. And I had the luck to find a vintage 602 china, which is technically not a china, but a swish (look up bell shapes). But it took really long to get it delivered, about some months. In the meantime, we recorded in studio and I used again the 2002 swish, and you guess what happened? It sounded and recorded fantastically. This is the spot where it is made for, and probably my playing improved a bit as well. Maybe it 'smoothed' a bit during my playing. Some say that (larger) cymbals have to 'swing in'.

Now, I have two swishes: the 20" 602 china for live events (fits well in my 22" case), and the 2002 I will keep, as it just is the sound I was looking for.

Sound remarks: the vintage 602s are no comparison to the new 602 line. Even the 22" 602 china is not as full sounding as the vintage 20", at least to my ears. I prefer the old ones. Not to forget: the 602 chinas have very nice bell sound, which is cutting. Also the new ones. More cutting than 2002. The 2002 swish can be a 'monster', and is definitely 'present' in a rock band. In a youtube video, I once saw JR Robinson playing two of them on the same set up. One with rivets, one without. Rivets normally push up the sound of a cymbal, but in this case, the rivets seemed to 'calm down' this swish.

Last remark: A few weeks ago, my local drum shop hat 5 (!) 2002 swishes in stock, all the 24" JR Robinson signature model. I made the challenge to have all of them put on one drum set. And all sounded very good. Their 'sound spread' was maybe the largest I have ever noticed on Paiste cymbals. But none of them was 'bad'.

What I would really love to hear in direct comparison, is the 22" Masters swish, but have not even seen one in person.
 
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