Mystery Supra?

carolina1964

carolina1964

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Fellas picked this up recently dirt cheap - but am confused by it. It appears to be a early 80's Super Sensitive Supra with bowtie lugs? Any ever seen one of these if so what the heck is it!! (It sounds great)
 

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i can't tell by the pic,but guessing that it may be a chicago large badge? around 84 or 85, the last supras and super sensitives that went out of chicago had gone to the large badge that was used in monroe.many of them had bowties. some also had no serial numbers on the badge. i see that yours does have a serial number.

mike
 
Thanks Mark - I just posted a pic of the badge and seems to confirm what you are saying - I'm guessing the serial number is irrelevant. Does this drum have any rarity to it at all cause I've never seen one on the bay or anywhere else.
 
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That looks like a late-era Chicago school drum.

Many of the 6.5 Supras with the SS mechanism were direct to school drums, both in ludalloy and hammered bronze.

Cool drum. They probably slapped bowties on it since it was going to a school would be my guess.

More importantly, HOW DOES IT SOUND?!?!?!?!
 
Thanks MG yeah thats good info probably would not show up in any catalog anywhere. Its actually sounds like my other 6.5 Supra sounds - but there is an issue with the SS mechanism looks like the Cam Slide has been replaced with an paper clip (southern ingenuity) so I need to order one and install it. Anybody ever replace a cam slide - how do you get the existing pin/rivot out and put a new one in?
 
I had a 6.5" Ludwig from around the same time period (late Chicago factory) which also had the Acrolite style (bowtie) lugs on it which
belonged to a friend and I sold it for him. At some point in the past, I was told by someone on this Forum (or the DCI precursor) that Ludwig may have "run out" of Imperial Lugs in that time frame and used Acro style lugs to keep the drums going out. I can't state with certainty that is true, but that is my recollection, on this subject.
 
The bowties and imperials use the same hole pattern and will interchange. It seems that if they ran out of one they would sometimes substitute the other to keep production moving. Sometimes you'll run across an acro/ blackro with imperials due to this.

I have also heard tell that Ludwig ran short of Imperials just before they left Chicago and substituted bowties rather than get in new inventory that would just have to be moved. I do not know how true that is but seems plausible. I have two drums from that era (large Chicago keystone badge from 1984) and both of mine do have the imperials.

That was Ludwig's 75th anniversary year as well which may have been what prompted the badge change back to the keystone design. The anniversary drums they made for that year also had bowties on them so maybe that had something to do with it. remember that the bowties (and classic single) lugs were developed by the Ludwigs during the WFL years....while the Imperial was actually designed by others at Ludwig and Ludwig back in the 30's during the time that the Ludwig family played no part in the company. They got that lug design when they bought their name back in 1955 so maybe they felt that the bowtie was more appropriate since that was their own lug rather than one other people designed.
 
The guys are correct in as much as it's one of the last out of Chicago. I also have one (but with no serial number). Some say that there's no extra value but I'm hedging my bets and have a large collection of '84 Ludwigs. Doesn't hurt that I'm from Chicag originally and toured the Damen Ave. facility (also met WFL II). Keep it, don't sell it....if I'm right, you can thank me later.

I too need to know how to get the cam off a Super Sensitive, it's a rivet, not a screw-in thing like they use now. Somebody please help us!
 
lersch said:
The guys are correct in as much as it's one of the last out of Chicago. I also have one (but with no serial number). Some say that there's no extra value but I'm hedging my bets and have a large collection of '84 Ludwigs. Doesn't hurt that I'm from Chicag originally and toured the Damen Ave. facility (also met WFL II). Keep it, don't sell it....if I'm right, you can thank me later.

I too need to know how to get the cam off a Super Sensitive, it's a rivet, not a screw-in thing like they use now. Somebody please help us! - Yes agreed Lersch somebody out there has to have swapped out a Cam Slide at one time would love any tips or tricks associated with the procedure.....
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I would not think it to be an especially rare drum.
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I'm not sure how you could ever prove 100% that it was made that way at the factory rather than something someone cooked up after the fact since anyone with some time and a screwdriver could make that mod. I'd be willing to bet the factory probably put those on there....but I probably wouldn't be willing to pay much of a premium price for it just because of those lugs.
 
Thanks KO for input - sounds like your saying it would be worth more if it had Imperials on it.
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No I wouldn't quite say that. I just think that it would be worth roughly the same as a similar drum with imperials or possibly bring just slightly more than a standard one with imperials. I think there is enough evidence to suggest those are probably factory lugs but I'm not sure that anyone would be willing to pay a lot more for the drum because of that one detail like they might for some other Ludwig production "quirk" (like say an 8 lug supra).

All just my own personal opinion of course.
 
Ludaloy is aluminun shell isn't it? Ifso, then keep the chome clean an shiny to prevent corrosion. Impossible to stop once it starts.
 
I've had a few supras with Bowie lugs. I still have a 5x14 that sounds too good to let go. They all had the large keystone Chicago badge.
 
OK Vistaliter thank you so much I'm glad there are others out there - it actually makes me feel better that I'm not alone in this thing. Are there any Super Sensitive Gurus out there that can provide some tips or tricks on installing a new Cam Slide?....Bueller.....Bueller...anyone
 
Vistaliter said:
I've had a few supras with Bowie lugs. I still have a 5x14 that sounds too good to let go. They all had the large keystone Chicago badge.
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Like KO said, I've heard that they ran out of Imperials at the Chicago (Damen Ave) factory and didn't want to order more Imps and then have to ship them to Monroe, and/or that it was a 75th Anniversary thing too. I know for sure that when Ludwig moved, Ludwig left all kinds of stuff curbside they didn't want to take (to pay to haul) to Monroe.

I've seen quite a few of these drums (Chicago large Keystone badged Supras w/Classic lugs-I actually have 4 at the moment:three 5x14s and one 6.5). This is the first 6.5 Supersensitive I've seen tho.
 
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